440sixpack wrote:I'm not attacking anyone. I'm just not back slapping and shining him on. it sounds like he made up his mind up before he asked so why ask for " opinions " if a high five is all that's desired. it seems there needs to be a tech forum and a support group forum.
There was never any reason to waste the money on a 4V in the first place because it would do no good on a smogger . so the intake would obviously be useless. headers on a street driven smogger are useless. changing the cam in a worn smogger isn't going to hurt anything but gains will be minimal . and without a new valve spring set even more minimal. so what did I get wrong ?
The OP asked for opinions and he got something he didn't want to hear. the truth. do what you're going to do it's not my problem.
Fast Eddie wrote:Stuka and 440,
I can see both your points to this debate. But I believe the lower compression in this day of piss poor gas is more a sign of our times than what we can build into a engine. Yes, the higher compression will equal more power, but getting the high octane gas to use in it is getting tougher and more $$$ by the day!!! Guess I'm just happy that my PO made the right choices and spent the $$ on the 360 I have so I don't have to!! I just get to enjoy my Jeep and drive it!!!
I still think headers and a nice exhaust system are a step in the right direction, PLUS it just sounds SO GOOD!!!
Ed
perfect! those headers are not badly priced... I think I found a pair of ceramic coated Doug Thorley headers and an intake for $250 for all of it... still waiting on pics.babywag wrote:Some folks have run these...
https://www.summitracing.com/parts/hed- ... wide-track
I've seen used ones pop up occasionally as well, IIRC someone on here was selling a pair a while back.
Used intakes are pretty easy to find, just be sure to get pics, and verify no stripped holes etc.
I've bought several over the years for way less than a new one.
Post a wanted thread?? Maybe someone has some stuff laying around.
I believe someone on here recently sold a TBI setup as well?
Yes, all ‘80-‘91 FSJ actually. All use same manifolds & y-pipe.Rinkle_Stinkle wrote:
Those headers say they are for a 80 Cherokee, will they still work on a 1988 wagoner?
I had read a little bit about that method on keeping the valves up. i'll be honest, I'm not doing the main bulk of the work on the heads and Cam. I have someone who is doing most of that and they pretty much told me they are more comfortable removing the heads fully and machining them down and plan on the long way rather then try and shortcut it and end up having to pull the heads anyways...Cecil14 wrote:Most people I've seen swear up and down by the Remflex gaskets. They're not cheap, but you really get what you pay for. There are also a multitude of locking header bolts on the market now that might help with the warping flange issue.
As to valve springs, you should be able to do them with the heads on the engine, but you need a way to hold the valves up in the head while you remove the springs. As soon as you take the keepers and retainers off, the valves will fall down into the cylinder. I've seen people stuff rope down in the cylinder, use compressed air, and a variety of other methods. If you don't keep the valves up tight to the head, it might be difficult to get the springs/keepers/retainers all back on when you're done.
aa
i just noticed that i will have to modify my exhaust to make these work.. thanx for the heads up on that. i would love to find a set that i won't have to do that on... sigh... everytime i think i thought everything out there is another issue...Fast Eddie wrote:OK looking at the Hedman headers, the 99246 and the 99256. One is a longer tube header and the other is shorter length like the Doug Thorley. For my 79 it takes me to the 99246, but the 99256 looks like a easier install and have to get a the exhaust made either way!! Any users out there on these Hedman headers?? THX!
I hear you on the budget. If it were mine, I would be pulling the head for sure. It's really not that much extra work, especially if everything is already out. Plus it gives you a much better view of what things look like inside.Rinkle_Stinkle wrote:I had read a little bit about that method on keeping the valves up. i'll be honest, I'm not doing the main bulk of the work on the heads and Cam. I have someone who is doing most of that and they pretty much told me they are more comfortable removing the heads fully and machining them down and plan on the long way rather then try and shortcut it and end up having to pull the heads anyways...
The headers I'm going to use are going to be cheap POS... i don't expect them to last 3 years honestly..... but i just can't stretch the budget anymore and that includes the pricier gaskets... i'll just have to cross my fingers and hope the normal gaskets hold.
I've told Rinkle' the same thing at least 5 times since he joined up, along with the cacophony of everyone else who's learned that lesson already. He's been set on headers since before his first post, so we're just going to have to let that dog hunt.Cecil14 wrote:Rinkle_Stinkle wrote:
Are your stock manifolds in good serviceable shape? If so, I think I would personally skip the cheap headers altogether at this point. The gain you will see from them as you have things setup now will be negligible, and the potential problems you're looking at are significant. Save your money on the cheap headers and save up for something decent, would be my advice.
aa
I’ve had 30 people tell me 30 different things from day one... I can’t follow everyone’s advice.REDONE wrote:I've told Rinkle' the same thing at least 5 times since he joined up, along with the cacophony of everyone else who's learned that lesson already. He's been set on headers since before his first post, so we're just going to have to let that dog hunt.Cecil14 wrote:Rinkle_Stinkle wrote:
Are your stock manifolds in good serviceable shape? If so, I think I would personally skip the cheap headers altogether at this point. The gain you will see from them as you have things setup now will be negligible, and the potential problems you're looking at are significant. Save your money on the cheap headers and save up for something decent, would be my advice.
aa
Im quickly figuring out where the most reliable information is coming from haha!fulsizjeep wrote:"On Facebook people swear I need headers to feel the full power." hahahahaha, not surprised...
My experience with Facebook FSJ discussions so far:
80% share that have no actual experience or clue
20% share with fairly sound advice
Maybe there is 5% margin of error...
Mix it all together and it is confusing. I have FB friends who I know have the experience and can articulate decent advice. Many of them, I know face to face. The rest of the FB jiberish I take with a grain of salt. I have to because there is so much BS and misinformation there. FB is a wasteland of (mis)information today that quickly fades away in the timeline tomorrow. I have suggested to many on FB that FSJN is a good place to get feedback on their questions. Even here on this forum, some comments and advice is inaccurate because the poster feels compelled to share something they think they know or understand. "I heard once." "Where?" "On Facebook." LOL
As far as stock AMC V8 exhaust manifolds go, they flow well just like they are. An improvement is made and often felt when running twice pipes. The two 401s we have with headers... The primary motivator to installing them was to replace one or both exhaust manifolds that were crapped out. New manifolds are kind of pricey and why would I want to put 30 something year old used manifolds on my motor?
Measure three times, cut once.