Good news!

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HowardT64
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Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:21 am

The Duck Blind is back up and running!! had a fellow come by and spend about 45 minutes tracing and yanking old vacuum lines. He got it so that it is running without all; the emissions nonsense. Still has a bit of trouble staying running, I think the timing is a bit off. Going to check it later. Glad to have her back up and going though :)

Thank you for all your input :) :-bd :-bd
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights


will e
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Re: Good news!

Post by will e » Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:22 pm

great news! Feels good doesn't it!
81 Waggy 'WILL E' Retired
82 Cherokee WT - SOA/SF/high steer/Alcan springs/agr box/Borgeson steering shaft/AMC 401/performer/holley TA/HEI/BeCool/727/ALTAS (2.0/2.72/5.44)/D60 Snofighter(Yukon Zip,hubs,stubs,4.56)/14 Bolt (FF,BF shave, Discs, ARB,Artec Truss)/MTR 37X12.5/Corbeau XRS Baja & 5 point retractable harness/Hella Aux lights/tuffy console/killer32 sliders/Evil Twin bumpers, rack and roll cage/WARN 8000/TT Fabworks steering brace/dual batts/custom TC skid plate/ARB fridge

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Stuka
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Re: Good news!

Post by Stuka » Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:43 pm

Good to hear!
1981 J10 AMC 258 with HEI and Weber 32/36 DGEV Carb, T176, NP208, D44/M23 with 4.56 gears and Detroit Locker, 6" lift, 33x12.50 Cooper STT's, BJ's Offroad Rear Dozer Bumper.
2017 JKU Rubicon Lifted and stuff
Pevious Jeeps: 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:45 pm

I will go down later and check a couple of things ... I may need to adjust the timing. I dont have a light, but i can do it by ear for now and get it darn close. But yes...good to have her back :)
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights


will e
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Re: Good news!

Post by will e » Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:56 am

A vacuum gauge is also a good way to set the timing. Set timing to highest vacuum at idle. Test drive. If it pings, back it off a bit.
81 Waggy 'WILL E' Retired
82 Cherokee WT - SOA/SF/high steer/Alcan springs/agr box/Borgeson steering shaft/AMC 401/performer/holley TA/HEI/BeCool/727/ALTAS (2.0/2.72/5.44)/D60 Snofighter(Yukon Zip,hubs,stubs,4.56)/14 Bolt (FF,BF shave, Discs, ARB,Artec Truss)/MTR 37X12.5/Corbeau XRS Baja & 5 point retractable harness/Hella Aux lights/tuffy console/killer32 sliders/Evil Twin bumpers, rack and roll cage/WARN 8000/TT Fabworks steering brace/dual batts/custom TC skid plate/ARB fridge

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Fri Apr 12, 2019 9:27 am

will e wrote:A vacuum gauge is also a good way to set the timing. Set timing to highest vacuum at idle. Test drive. If it pings, back it off a bit.
ok...got to find a vac gauge...thanks :)
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Mon May 20, 2019 9:16 am

Hey gang, trying to figure something out. The Jeep runs okay when I first get her going...after she warms up, she runs like crap. I think the CTO valve is causing this. Can I eliminate the at valve all together?
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights


will e
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Re: Good news!

Post by will e » Mon May 20, 2019 7:42 pm

Yes. But better to find out what is causing the issue. That vacuum gauge you got for the timing will help. Connect it to manifold vacuum and see if the issue starts at the same time manifold vacuum drops. If it does, you have a leak. Perhaps in the CTO system.

Another option is to block off most of the vacuum connections to the manifold (not the brakes or PVC). After it warms up, try reconnecting them and see if one of them causes the problem.
81 Waggy 'WILL E' Retired
82 Cherokee WT - SOA/SF/high steer/Alcan springs/agr box/Borgeson steering shaft/AMC 401/performer/holley TA/HEI/BeCool/727/ALTAS (2.0/2.72/5.44)/D60 Snofighter(Yukon Zip,hubs,stubs,4.56)/14 Bolt (FF,BF shave, Discs, ARB,Artec Truss)/MTR 37X12.5/Corbeau XRS Baja & 5 point retractable harness/Hella Aux lights/tuffy console/killer32 sliders/Evil Twin bumpers, rack and roll cage/WARN 8000/TT Fabworks steering brace/dual batts/custom TC skid plate/ARB fridge

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Mon May 20, 2019 8:01 pm

I think I figured out what may be going on...I found this article....

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2015/04/2 ... uum-sucks/

What he describes in this article, is EXACTLY what is going on with mine!!!! Ill check the connections
make sure they are clean. I will also check the timing cause it runs like crap when it warms up.. ;)

Im excited :)
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Wed May 22, 2019 8:50 am

Okay, I know I have most likely bored people to death with this subject...Apologies for that. If I can eliminate the use of the CTO switch that will fix much of what is going on. I will also check the idle control solenoid. Anyone know or can sketch a quick diagram and show me what goes where?

Ill go down in a bit and take a picture or two for reference. Something tells me I could have this fixed in on time and not spend any money.

Pictures will be avail able shortly...
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights


letank
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Re: Good news!

Post by letank » Sun May 26, 2019 11:07 am

depending on how many CTO you have

single CTO for timing

from this post

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=157017

Image

you can go manifold vacuum to the distributor, like it happens when the engine is cold. Connect the green line from intake manifold at the CTO directly to your distributor, Green to White in the above schematic.
When the coolant is warm, your idle speed will be higher, and it may trigger other issues such as stalling when shifted in D or R... lower idle speed at the solenoid a bit IF needed

The article addresses the low idle speed... so you can increase the idle speed as needed at the solenoid, if you have a solenoid, otherwise the throttle stop screw is burried next to the throttle shaft lever

the throttle stop stop can be seen behind the 5th link from the left of chain for the cruise control in the pict below

Image
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Tue May 28, 2019 10:34 am

I checked things this morning. The CTO's are not connected at all, not is the Idle control solenoid. I cannot find the plug that goes onto the solenoid...any clues as to where? It still pops and makes noise, thinking I need to adjust the timing a bit and the carb, just not sure how to do that. At least I can verify that no CTO's are hooked up. I am almost there :) Just need a little tweak i Think and I am good as gold :)

If I remove the control solenoid, what adjustments would have t make?
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights


letank
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Re: Good news!

Post by letank » Tue May 28, 2019 10:28 pm

HowardT64 wrote:I checked things this morning. The CTO's are not connected at all, not is the Idle control solenoid. I cannot find the plug that goes onto the solenoid...any clues as to where? It still pops and makes noise, thinking I need to adjust the timing a bit and the carb, just not sure how to do that. At least I can verify that no CTO's are hooked up. I am almost there :) Just need a little tweak i Think and I am good as gold :)

If I remove the control solenoid, what adjustments would have t make?
if you remove the control solenoid, your idle speed is likely to be lower, unless the solenoid is not working or not set properly. The solenoid job is to set a higher idle speed when the ignition is on, when off the solenoid retracts and the idle goes lower to prevent dieseling

As far as your CTO, is all depend on the vacuum lines routing, it is usually a bag of noddles, may take a few pictures... or try to follow the schematic from above

As for popping noises, may be your timing is off
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Wed May 29, 2019 9:37 am

I understand all the functions well enough now, lord knows I have read a lot about it. I am just not finding where this solenoid is supposed to attach. I think once I fond a way to hook it back up and check the timing I should be okay. Thanks for your patience and help :)
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights

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HowardT64
Posts: 1175
Joined: Sun May 05, 2013 2:47 am
Location: Athens,Texas

Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Wed May 29, 2019 9:49 am

I found this from O'collins Jeep site...I think this is it....Image

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1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights

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Renodemona
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Re: Good news!

Post by Renodemona » Wed May 29, 2019 6:36 pm

I might have missed it, but, why are you keeping the CTO stuff? I know it helps with emissions and has to be there for visual inspection, but you can run vacuum advance straight off the manifold though you'll have to reset timing. Something about ported vs non ported. The more vacuum stuff you can eliminate the easier it is to trace problems. Eliminate the EGR if you can while you're at it. The control solenoid is not necessary, though that depends on the carb I guess, so it might be. Running good at startup then running like crap once warm suggests timing to me. Sometimes the springs in the distributor get all wonky and then timing doesn't advance right even when getting vacuum. I'm sure I was only slightly helpful, but, good luck!
"Wait, what's on fire!?"
--------------------------------------------------------------
1976 Cherokee w/t 'Susan' 401/TH400/QT(PT)
FiTech Go EFI, Edelbrock Performer intake
3" Rough Country Springs, HEI Dizzy
-------------------------------------------------------------
1972 Wagoneer 'Meredith' 360/TH400/D20
FiTech Go EFI
4" Alcan Springs, HEI Dizzy
-------------------------------------------------------------
2018 Cherokee Trailhawk V6 'Sedna'


letank
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Re: Good news!

Post by letank » Wed May 29, 2019 11:02 pm

Renodemona wrote:I---snip--- Eliminate the EGR if you can while you're at it.
very good point, as the EGR might still be connected to an EGR CTO, for the years after 85, it is the double CTO in the back of the intake, the simple way is too disconnect the hose at the EGR mushroom top and plug the hose with a golf T or a nail of the proper size.

For the solenoid, as you have found out, the electrical wire for the solenoid is orange and goes along with... other controlled items, the carb bowl vent and the electric choke, you can try to trace where they all meet somewhere by the coil loom you will find a loose wire with a rubber covered female connector that is the complement of the solenoid male connector
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work

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HowardT64
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Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Thu May 30, 2019 8:15 am

AHA!!! now im onto something...thanks!!!!
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights

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Topic author
HowardT64
Posts: 1175
Joined: Sun May 05, 2013 2:47 am
Location: Athens,Texas

Re: Good news!

Post by HowardT64 » Tue Jul 02, 2019 11:48 am

I have some really good news now :) Found a couple of loose plugs and wires. To get to them I had to get out my dremel and cut off the metal uprights for the emissions tubing. Now they are nice and snug, plug wires on and doing well. I adjusted the timing a tad, now the popping is gone :)

She fires right up and revs nicely now :) All I have to do now, is have the C Converter put on, vac the AC, and put my new PS pump on and Ill be golden :)

Good to have her back and running like she should be :)
1990 Grand Wagoneer
Duck Blind 2
360 V8
A/C P/S P/B P/W
Solar Equipped
55 watt Burner Fog Lights

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