86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

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jaded13640
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Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:20 pm

86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by jaded13640 »

I've got a friend of a friend that asked me to look at his jeep. The transmission is shot, no reverse most of the time. He initially called to get a filter and fluid change. LOL I hated to break it to him that doing that for the first time because the trans is slipping or broken doesn't save it, it often kills it. Here's where you guys can help maybe. I know they used all different engines and transmissions and rear ends and so on. This one has a 360 cid engine according to the info sticker that was still under the hood on the radiator support...which surprised me! I'm a Mopar guy and I can tell you it doesn't look like any 360 I've ever seen in a Mopar. And the trans based on the shape of the pan, does not look to be a 727 or 904. If it was either of them I could do a charity repair for the guy. He's in his 80s, lives alone, never married, no kids, no cellphone even. So now with nearly no vehicle, everyone that knows him is worried sick because he's taking the thing out for errands and such yet. Today it was a high of 21 degrees F! No phone, no AAA and no reverse gear...LOL....so I REALLY want to help the old fella out.

Can anyone tell me what transmission is in it based on the info I've given?

If not I have the vin if someone can decode it.

1JCNJ15U8CT09218 I'm not at all familiar with Jeep vins, in fact that U in there could be a V, it was getting dark when I went over there. He insisted I drive it around the field...He was desperately hoping to have me tell him "I could add some concoction to the trans and it'd be fixed" but that was clearly not possible.

He never made much money. They had a family florist but since covid he's had almost zero work. He had polio as a kid so his one hand and arm is kinda dead but he insists I'll get paid while I'm insisting I won't charge him if I can help. LOL Honestly...while I'm typing...this is kind of a funny story if it didn't involved a bunch of people worrying about it. The thing isn't new enough where we'd likely be able to find a "good used trans" for it. But stranger things have happened. Maybe someone will say, "oh, actually that is a 727 in a different case. I would just tear into it then. I suspect it's one of the many different other ones they used at the time. But a guy can hope right? LOL

If anyone can help, even if it's just a little bit of information, I would surely be grateful!

Happy New Year to everyone!

will e
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Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by will e »

Hi, It probably has the AMC 360. Do a quick search for images and you will see what the AMC engines look like. Very easy to recognize.

An 86 waggy would have a TF727. It's basically the same as the Mopar with a different housing.
81 Waggy 'WILL E' Retired
82 Cherokee WT - SOA/SF/high steer/Alcan springs/agr box/Borgeson steering shaft/AMC 401/performer/holley TA/HEI/BeCool/727/ALTAS (2.0/2.72/5.44)/D60 Snofighter(Yukon Zip,hubs,stubs,4.56)/14 Bolt (FF,BF shave, Discs, ARB,Artec Truss)/MTR 37X12.5/Corbeau XRS Baja & 5 point retractable harness/Hella Aux lights/tuffy console/killer32 sliders/Evil Twin bumpers, rack and roll cage/WARN 8000/TT Fabworks steering brace/dual batts/custom TC skid plate/ARB fridge
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Stuka
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Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by Stuka »

Welcome to the forum.

No Full Size Jeep ever used a mopar engine. They used Rambler, Kaiser, Buick, and AMC. Chrysler did not buy jeep until 1986. AMC owned it for the decade before that. And because the Grand Wagoneer was not going to live past 1991 anyway, Chrysler only changed what it had to.

Going off the VIN its an 1982 with an AMC 360, which means it will have a TF727. But, the case is AMC specific. The guts should be standard parts. Though it may or may not have a lockup converter.

As for finding a used trans, its not that hard super find FSJs in junk yards, they are out there. But the condition of the trans would be unknown.
2017 JKU Rubicon
Pevious Jeeps: 1981 J10, 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ
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dodgerammit
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Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by dodgerammit »

I'd check fluid level first. These things need to be warmed up along with being level and in neutral to properly check. They'll read higher when cold due to converter drainback. Mine reads quite a bit over full when cold, but in operating range once warmed up.
84 Grand Waggy-Radio Flyer (Garnet Red/3M Ebony Metallic woodgrain, with honey interior) AMC 360 :cry: 2004 4.8LS/Advance Adapter/727/242 D44/AMC20 Serehill tailgate and headlight harnesses :fsj: Ongoing thread-viewtopic.php?t=11897

92 Wrangler Islander 4.0/32RH/231 D30/D35 RHD

letank
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Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by letank »

the usual rules apply:

1) what is the color and smell of the trany fluid... probably brown... so get a trans filter kit, drain and refill about 4q,

BUT there is still about 8Q in the system...

There are 2 ways A) Get a drain plug kit, drill a hole in the trans pan so you can drain more of the nasty stuff...

or B) disconnect one of the transmission cooling line (TBD) and drain the remaining trans fluid, Start engine, put in neutral, the fluid circulate tap the accelerator and you get 4 Q in a minute. Stop engine, refill trans and repeat until fluid is the same color as the new fluid -bright red-

NOW which line to disconnect... IIRC the output is supposedly the front most metal line of the transmission case

I had to check:
http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=124756

and rechecked here with various trans
https://www.tciauto.com/cooler-fittings

so follow that tube and disconnect at the bottom of the coolant radiator... or the auxiliary transcooler lines, whichever is easier -it is always a mess, the rubber line is about to fail because it is cracked... and dried

Also , when you pull the filter out (3 screws) one of the servo (POST EDIT : I think it is the accumulator) may drop... with spring and what not... it is a good idea to put a piece of cardboard to control parts loss... the servo seal might be weak and it is going to be a while before you can get enough pressure to move the vehicle.

Thank you for helping a needy neighbour...

and little more infos about the layout a few posts down

https://www.fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=343

Image
Last edited by letank on Tue Jan 04, 2022 7:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)

Topic author
jaded13640
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2022 9:20 pm

Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by jaded13640 »

will e, that's what I have heard. The 360 looks a little more like a ford than a Mopar but it's clearly neither. I'm certain it's an AMC. I'm glad to hear they used 727s behind them, I've got everything but the filter on my trans bench. They old guy will be so happy.

Michel, I've never seen a filter and fluid bring back a missing gear but I'll take a closer look. Given all the times I've run into this and did what the customer asked, change the filter and fluid please, and pretty much every time the trans was dead in a couple of weeks, I'm reluctant to try to save it...but, if by some miracle it worked...it would save that old dude a lot of cash. But I'm not going to charge him for the rebuild beyond the parts anyway. If F&F change doesn't work it's just wasted money. But I'll think carefully about it. What happened it seems is that he never checked the fluid and it was very low. But it's a 727 you check it in neutral. Did he? I don't know

Thanks to everyone who replied. I went into this post with a lot of vague memories. It looks like some of them were right. I'll be keeping an eye on this forum. So many aren't worth a fart in the wind anymore! LOL

Thank everyone,

Wayne

will e
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Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by will e »

Wayne, I am glad everyone could pitch in and help answer your questions. I don't know where you live but if it's somewhere colder it might not be a bad idea to check the fluid and, if that doesn't work, rebuild. It would suck for the old guy to get stranded in the cold.
81 Waggy 'WILL E' Retired
82 Cherokee WT - SOA/SF/high steer/Alcan springs/agr box/Borgeson steering shaft/AMC 401/performer/holley TA/HEI/BeCool/727/ALTAS (2.0/2.72/5.44)/D60 Snofighter(Yukon Zip,hubs,stubs,4.56)/14 Bolt (FF,BF shave, Discs, ARB,Artec Truss)/MTR 37X12.5/Corbeau XRS Baja & 5 point retractable harness/Hella Aux lights/tuffy console/killer32 sliders/Evil Twin bumpers, rack and roll cage/WARN 8000/TT Fabworks steering brace/dual batts/custom TC skid plate/ARB fridge
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Stuka
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Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by Stuka »

I have definitely seen low fluid result in reverse not working.

But it sounds like you have a lot of experience, so I wont assume to tell you what you should do. Its certainly possible a flush and filter won't help anything.

And thanks for helping out somebody in need!
2017 JKU Rubicon
Pevious Jeeps: 1981 J10, 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

Dr.Bob
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Re: 86 grand wagoneer transmission issues

Post by Dr.Bob »

Fluid level, band adjustment, restricted filter, and misadjusted/broken throttle-valve linkage can all disable a TF727 in these GWs. My '87 J-20's transmission was barely-operable, but after the fluid-filter/band-adjustment, freeing-up and adjusting the Throttle-valve linkage, and getting the fluid-level right (yes, you check it in Neutral, with the engine running), it shifts perfectly.

Good of you to help him like this, and keep one of these trucks alive!
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