Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

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Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Everyone loves a resurrection story, right? Especially when it concerns a classic 4x4 that would have gone to the scrapper.

It all started one day in November, a friend asked me to go along with him to look at a Datsun 240Z parts car in Grass Valley, CA, not far from my house. What ended up happening was me dragging home a bright pumpkin orange Cherokee Chief wide track. I absolutely did not need another project (I've got too many vehicles as it is), but the condition of the Jeep was just too good to let it get crushed. After the deal was made, and the Jeep pulled from its resting spot where it had dug in over the years, it was trailered back to my shop to be brought back to life. Along the drive home I made a deal with myself that I would get it running and driving and then park it outside so I could focus on paying work. That was a month and a half ago...

Bringing a vehicle back to life is supremely rewarding, and if you stick to a plan of attack, it can get done on a shoestring budget. Luckily for me, Jeep parts are a lot less expensive and more easily obtained than other makes of vehicles, or so I thought. Having already done a couple Jeep restorations, I knew that most mechanical parts are easy enough to source. It's when you start getting into the body and trim that parts become hard to find, and the quality or reproduction parts tends to be on the lower end of the scale. I won't get into name bashing, but let's just say that when I see two specific brands show up in the search results, I try my hardest to ignore them. But back to the story.

My usual plan of attack for a resurrection is to do the bare minimum to get it running and driving and then make an assessment of the larger picture work that lay ahead. This particular Jeep had been sitting for so long that nearly everything I touched turned to dist in my hands. The radiator literally fell apart when I removed it. Every hose was hard as rock. The brakes were stuck and the transmission pan, pickup and filter were nowhere to be found. My local radiator shop supplied me with a new brass radiator and cleaned and sealed the fuel tank, Summit Racing provided me with a cheap chrome trans pan, filter and pickup tube, which turned out to be wrong, but we'll get to that later. The carburetor throttle would not move. which meant an immediate rebuild before any attempts at firing it off. Then, when I put a socket on the crank pulley bolt to try and turn the engine, it would not budge. Pulling the spark plugs revealed rust in the number seven cylinder, which anyone knows is not a great sign. Side note - why do people remove air cleaner lids and leave the hood open for years on end?

Also, the distributor cap and rotor were missing, so a new pair were installed. More on that later as well.

After soaking the cylinders overnight, the crank finally was able to rotate, which gave me hope, but I was still worried that the motor was junk. So with the rebuilt carb installed. All new vacuum hoses correctly connected to the various switches, valves and ports, a battery was dropped in and cranking ensued. Did it fire right up? Well, no, not at first, but fire it did and that's when I knew I was in trouble...

Let's start with a few pics of day one.
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Re: Cherokee Wife Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Ok, just realized the major error. Is there any way to correct the spelling in the title? Wife track...???
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stuka »

I fixed it for you. You are able to edit your posts also if need be (use the button with the pencil on it).

Outside of any potential engine issues, it looks very solid. I don't notice any major rust in the photos.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Thanks Stuka. Is that like WWII Stuka?
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Day two of the project ended with the engine turning freely and all parts present and installed to prepare for running the engine, and a possible first test drive. A few little things slowed the progress a bit. One of them was oil pressure. Cranking for a while yielded no oil pressure, which made me nervous, but I had to remove the distributor to see what was wrong with it, so while the distributor was out, I primed the oil pump with a drill.

Searching the web for distributor parts and info quickly informed me that the original Prestolite distributor was fraught with problems from the beginning. Mine was no different. The mechanical advance was rusted stuck, the lever arm which actuates the vacuum advance was broken in two, and the rotor hit the cap. The latter problem obviously has more to do with crappy replacement parts, but also, the two tangs that hold the cap from rotating can be bent one way or the other to justify the cap in either direction, which adds to the issue. After a thorough cleaning of the internals, I welded up the distributor cam slots and filed them smooth again so the mechanical advance worked smoothly and then turned my attention to the vacuum lever thingy. It is plastic and flimsy, so I figured I'd make a less flimsy version out of aluminum.

The distributor cap and rotor issue was not (and still is not) solved immediately, but some grinding on three of the terminal posts inside the cap allowed the rotor to spin inside the cap with destroying it. Note - you would not be able to check this with the distributor installed in the engine. Having it out on the workbench allowed me to test fit the cap and rotor.

Pics below are of the carb rebuild, the distributor and it's new lever, plus a couple random pics of the first couple days.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

With the fuel tank installed with new hoses and fuel pump, a couple gallons were added to the tank and it was time to fire the engine.

Note that at this point, we're still in the discovery phase and assuming nothing. I did, however, treat the engine and engine bay to a pressure wash. I hate working on dirty stuff.

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Cut to the chase - the engine fired right off and with great oil pressure, I ran it for a few seconds to give it a listen. No bearing clunks or lifter rattles, running on all cylinders, it sounded pretty good actually. Without a trans pan installed, I couldn't drive it yet, so that's where I turned next.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Searching the web for info on the Jeep TH400 was enlightening enough, and basically revealed no surprises, except when it cam to the oil pan and filter, I found that the pan and pickup I ordered were incompatible. Have you ever tried ordering a TH400 oil pickup tube? There's only one AC Delco offering and a couple billet pieces available, but the length is what got me in the end. The pickup tube I had was too long and forced the filter into the bottom of the oil pan. There was actually about a 3/4" gap between the pan and trans body. Desperate to drive the beast, I carefully chucked the plastic tube in the 3-jaw lathe chuck and turned it down to the correct length. I knew it was only temporary, so I didn't really care if it wasn't perfect. Luckily I mistakenly ordered two pickup tubes, so if one broke in the lathe, I had one more available to screw up.

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With the trans pan finally installed and about 2 gallons of DEXIII dumped in, the wheels went on and the truck was dropped off the lift for a test drive. Which did not go so well. Reverse came with a loud bang, and there were no forward gears to speak of. Back on the lift the Jeep went and the entire drivetrain was torn from it. I originally felt like leaving the engine, but temptation got the better of me and that was removed as well.

I have a transmission rebuilder that I use who specializes in Turbo Hydramatic transmissions and he agreed to rebuild the trans in a day for $1000, with a new converter. When I got to his shop in Olivehurst, we disassembled the trans on his bench and found a couple surprises. First, the pump was in good shape, but the fluid was thick with metal. Second, the valvebody had been modified and a shift kit installed by someone who did not know what they were doing. Third, the first gear hub was worn out completely with a giant 1/8" plus step in it. Ed has a ton of experience and assured me that none of this would be a problem. We agreed to leave the shift kit, but install it properly, then he said he would remove one of the governor springs and a new sprag, making the trans better than new.

With the trans back in the shop, attention was then turned to the transfer case. Disassembly of the t-case revealed a super stretched chain, but all other parts in good shape.

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Last edited by Stoffregen M-sports on Wed Dec 29, 2021 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

For the t-case, I wanted to delete the full-time-4 feature, but all information about the Mile Marker 4x2 kit showed that it was no longer in production. I just happened to stumble upon the https://www.bjsoffroad.com/ website and found it there. They also supplied the t-case gasket/seal kit and a new billet vacuum diaphragm. With the case torn apart and cleaned up, the new seals were installed. Then the 4x2 kit went in. Luckily I read ahead on the install instructions and did not install the rear output seal beforehand, as the new rear output shaft needs to go in, along with the new shift collar, before the seal can be installed. Assembly was easy enough, but there were a couple things wrong with the parts from BJ's. First off, the screws that hold the two carrier halves together were too long and had to be cut. They are a 12 point head custom for this application, so cutting them was my only option. Next, and this isn't a problem with their parts, but two of the seals were damaged in shipping, so they were straightened out before installing them. Lastly, the vacuum diaphragm did not function in the forward direction. I attempted to re-seal it, but decided to omit it for the final assembly. It's not easy to get to in the vehicle and I didn't want to have to fiddle with it once the t-case was installed in the truck. Full disclosure - BJ's offers great quality parts, and I did not make them aware of the problems with the too-long screws or the seals, but I'm sure given the chance, they would have made good on it.

One area of the t-case assembly that was a real bear was the rear output shaft bearing removal and installation. The c-clip that retains the bearing is a good 2" down the bore and impossible to get out without scratching the aluminum housing. Once it was removed, I hit the corners of the clip with a flap wheel and rounded/smoothed the corners so it would go in easier.

Pics of the t-case assembly are limited, because I was anxious and forgot. But here's what I got.

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Stock vs BJ's vacuum diaphragm

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Completed case installed on the rebuilt TH400

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Last edited by Stoffregen M-sports on Wed Dec 29, 2021 3:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Engine out, time to undress it and get to work. More later.

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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stuka »

Stoffregen M-sports wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 9:53 am Thanks Stuka. Is that like WWII Stuka?
Yup!

Looking at your photos I see you have a prestolite distributor. I would not put time into that thing. I highly advise upgrading to either an HEI or a Duraspark ignition. Duraspark was factory equipment from 78-91. HEI was never stock, but it’s easy to install since it’s just one wire, and several companies make them to fit an AMC V8 or i6. (I have used CRT several times).
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by ScramblerCJ8 »

Ha, it goes to show how easy we jump on a new Jeep project, just to get side track and fully involved on it.
I'm steel have my 88 Grand Wagoneer and the 66 J truck sitting and waiting their turn. Finally finish my CJ 7 and soon will be able to star on the Wagon
Reading all this post help me not loose my motivation.

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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Stuka wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 1:26 pm
Stoffregen M-sports wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 9:53 am Thanks Stuka. Is that like WWII Stuka?
Yup!

Looking at your photos I see you have a prestolite distributor. I would not put time into that thing. I highly advise upgrading to either an HEI or a Duraspark ignition. Duraspark was factory equipment from 78-91. HEI was never stock, but it’s easy to install since it’s just one wire, and several companies make them to fit an AMC V8 or i6. (I have used CRT several times).
Duraspark, is that the Autolite distributor I read about? I wonder if CA emissions would be affected by the distributor swap. I wonder if they would even notice the swap. I bet they would notice an HEI in there.

For what it's worth, my Prestolite works fine now, but it did take some work. I still need to install a new, stiffer spring on the primary weight (because it brings too much timing in too quickly) but other than that, could it be the plastic lever breaking which gave the Prestolite a bad name?
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

ScramblerCJ8 wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 2:49 pm Ha, it goes to show how easy we jump on a new Jeep project, just to get side track and fully involved on it.
I'm steel have my 88 Grand Wagoneer and the 66 J truck sitting and waiting their turn. Finally finish my CJ 7 and soon will be able to star on the Wagon
Reading all this post help me not loose my motivation.
There's a philosophy in automotive restoration (or modifications) - to maintain motivation, you should do something every day. Even if it's just organizing parts.

Glad to help! And thanks for posting.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stuka »

Stoffregen M-sports wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 3:14 pm
Stuka wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 1:26 pm
Stoffregen M-sports wrote: Wed Dec 29, 2021 9:53 am Thanks Stuka. Is that like WWII Stuka?
Yup!

Looking at your photos I see you have a prestolite distributor. I would not put time into that thing. I highly advise upgrading to either an HEI or a Duraspark ignition. Duraspark was factory equipment from 78-91. HEI was never stock, but it’s easy to install since it’s just one wire, and several companies make them to fit an AMC V8 or i6. (I have used CRT several times).
Duraspark, is that the Autolite distributor I read about? I wonder if CA emissions would be affected by the distributor swap. I wonder if they would even notice the swap. I bet they would notice an HEI in there.

For what it's worth, my Prestolite works fine now, but it did take some work. I still need to install a new, stiffer spring on the primary weight (because it brings too much timing in too quickly) but other than that, could it be the plastic lever breaking which gave the Prestolite a bad name?

The distributor is fine to change out. The only thing that matters is what the timing Advance is set to when is being tested.

The issue with the prestolite is the ignition modules are a lot more expensive, and prone to failure.

The Duraspark (also branded as autolite) are much easier to find and a lot more reliable.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

I've been eyeballing the Autolite distributor. Summit sells a rebuilt unit for about $130. Is there a tech section that explains or shows how to convert?

Thanks again.
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

The main reason I wanted to pull the motor was, get this, to better clean the engine bay. Yes, I really do hate dirty engine bays. I figured that would allow me to have a peek inside the motor and reseal it too. I don't get fooled by a dry motor anymore. If it's been sitting for a long time, even if it doesn't leak now, it will in a short while. Rubber gets dry and brittle from lack of heat and exercise. So I ordered up a compete engine gasket kit, new water pump, ported vacuum switches, water outlet, thermostat, and got started.

The teardown was pretty straightforward and yielded no surprises. The original plan was to leave the long block assembled, ie - don't remove the cylinder heads, but I had new gaskets and was dying to see what the #7 bore looked like. With the heads off, I found a set of .030 pistons in the bores. I suspected that the engine had been rebuilt, hence the Ford dark blue engine paint, but this confirmed it. All the bores were in decent shape, with no ridges and very little shadow from where the #7 piston rings rusted themselves to the bore, so I ran a dingleberry hone through the block and put it all back together. Note - it is surprising how much more bite a simple ball hone job can give to old rings. You could tell by the sound of the pistons going up and down that the new hone marks would help the old rings seal up tight. All new seals gaskets, valve stem seals, etc were installed during the process and the combustion chambers, pistons, ports and valves were de-carboned too. Assembling the heads, the valves had that nice bounce and the guides were in pretty good shape so there's plenty of life left in them.

Engine paint color seems to be a matter of taste, but on some of my builds, I like to be sympathetic to the roots and searched for a correct engine color. I found three and basically just chose the one I liked best. New paint won't stick to a dirty engine though, and cleaning an assembled engine without getting grit all over is impossible, so I was sure to do the cleaning before I tore it down. Then a bunch of chemicals later, had a surface ready for paint. You may also notice that the valve covers don't match. Well I had them in black primer and decided to set them on the heads. The look is reminiscent of an old Ford big block in a GT40 race car, so I left covered them in satin black and installed them.

The timing chain was pretty stretched though, to the point I thought it might skip a tooth, so I ordered up a Cloyes double roller set from Summit, which turned out to be wrong, so after a bit more research another timing set was obtained and installed. It was pretty tight and that's a good sign.

The intake manifold was treated to as many new parts as I could source. The ported vacuum switches were getting brittle and the old thermostat housing had holes in it, plus I had a stash of OEM Jeep black oxide SEMS screws in a box and decided to dress the motor up with new hardware as well. I also spent time cleaning the paint off the aluminum parts so I could leave them in their natural state. I think the overall package looks very nice. But that's hardly the point...

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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

Don't know why the pics are out of order. Maybe they will correct themselves...

Time to drop the motor in, before the trans and t-case. It's easier that way. Normally I have the body off the frame, which makes assembly much cleaner, but I'll get to the chassis restoration later. Hopefully in 2022.

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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stoffregen M-sports »

I didn't get any pics of the trans/t-case install, but I will say, it's pretty tight under there with the fuel tank installed. I actually had to remove the high/low linkage arm to get it all past the coffin shaped fuel tank, but once there, it bolted up no problem. New motor mounts and a poly trans mount from Energy suspension were installed too. I like the Energy Suspension mount because it features a locking mechanism internally so that if the poly ever tears, the trans won't flop around. Most OEM bushing mounts don't even have that feature.

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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Chubbinius »

Great to see how much work you are getting done on the Chief and how quickly you are able to flow through it! Enjoying this thread very much, thank you for sharing your process and work!
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Re: Cherokee Wide Track Resurrection - Stoffregen Motorsports

Post by Stuka »

Stoffregen M-sports wrote: Thu Dec 30, 2021 10:22 am I've been eyeballing the Autolite distributor. Summit sells a rebuilt unit for about $130. Is there a tech section that explains or shows how to convert?

Thanks again.
It uses a different ignition module, so that would have to be wired in. It’s why many go HEI instead, just one wire.

But the Duraspark setup is covered by any TSM for 78+.

If your current setup is working, you can stick with it. If you find you can’t find a good ignition module that lasts, consider switching then.
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