88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis frame swap

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Stuka
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Stuka »

Crisd wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 9:59 pm
Stuka wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:07 pm Ahh, you are doing it a bit different than the build I listed above. In the one that I linked, they cut the frame in half and shortened it. Looks like you are moving the rear axle forward and chopping off the back?
No, re-read the narrative above the first picture posted today.


1. Knock out rivets. 2. Measure 25.5 inches from end of front frame rail (with rivets out, the frame drops into two pieces) and make one cut. 3. Move the two pieces back together and use the rear frame rail holes as a pattern to drill new frame bolt holes in the front piece. Bolt together.
Ahh, I missed that you had two new posts. I looked at the most recent one which has the frame in one piece. My mistake.
2017 JKU Rubicon
Pevious Jeeps: 1981 J10, 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

SJTD
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by SJTD »

bigun wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:29 pm Watching this
There was a guy on you tube back east who had a supply of hemi powered Dodge vehicles something about one of the seams causing the upper body to rust out. Anyway he would leave the dash and floor board on the donor frame then set the other body on top said it was easier than trying to run all the wires
Was he putting a new body Dodge body on the old floor? Or some kinda swap? Hard to believe this is easier for either.
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by bigun »

SJTD wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:25 am
bigun wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:29 pm Watching this
There was a guy on you tube back east who had a supply of hemi powered Dodge vehicles something about one of the seams causing the upper body to rust out. Anyway he would leave the dash and floor board on the donor frame then set the other body on top said it was easier than trying to run all the wires
Was he putting a new body Dodge body on the old floor? Or some kinda swap? Hard to believe this is easier for either.
The one I watched was a 1952 IH L-110, kind of bummed me because he shortened the 9 foot bed rather than
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPl8VIWFVwE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IVVxT8q1CM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hOh6zH_tO8

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Crisd
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

bigun wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 6:06 am
SJTD wrote: Mon Jun 21, 2021 9:25 am
bigun wrote: Sun Jun 20, 2021 8:29 pm Watching this
There was a guy on you tube back east who had a supply of hemi powered Dodge vehicles something about one of the seams causing the upper body to rust out. Anyway he would leave the dash and floor board on the donor frame then set the other body on top said it was easier than trying to run all the wires
Was he putting a new body Dodge body on the old floor? Or some kinda swap? Hard to believe this is easier for either.
The one I watched was a 1952 IH L-110, kind of bummed me because he shortened the 9 foot bed rather than
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SPl8VIWFVwE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IVVxT8q1CM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hOh6zH_tO8
His work is awesome, but infinitely more complex than what I'm doing!
Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
Gray '88 LS ECU swap project
Green '91 all stock except vacuum hose mod

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Crisd
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

The Ford Explorer tank hit the Ram cross brace and needed to be trimmed. After trimming cross-brace, the tank itself needed to be trimmed to fit in the narrower space of the Ram. I wanted to use the Ram fuel tank straps because I knew if I fit the tank to the straps that the tank would fit with out hitting anything. This turned into what has become to be referred to as an abortion by my friends. Its a freaking mess. In the future I may build a new tank from scratch, in retrospect, it would have been easier and much cleaner looking. After welding and pressure checking I had some pin hole leaks. I kept chasing holes so I decided to braze all the welds to close up all the pinholes. Then for good measure I used an apoxy tank sealer (the silver stuff you see). The left over sealer after dumping the mixture out was used to paint the exterior of the tank. The pic with the bolt in it was my drain hole that I drilled and welded a nut on, it was needed to drain the etching solution and the epoxy. After cutting out the triangle sections from the tank I used a press to close the gap.
A new Ford fuel sender and pump assembly will be used in the tank after it dries.
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Last edited by Crisd on Tue Jun 22, 2021 9:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

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Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

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Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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TurboJ4000
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by TurboJ4000 »

Are you planning to weld the frame back together or just bolts? The original just riveted together is much different than bolted together.

I would think at the very least it needs to be welded along that seam but a straight vertical weld isnt great for the stresses on a frame either which is why this is often done at an angle and with fish plates to add strength. Looks awesome though I love the body swap idea (hence I'm doing one too).

I am confused by your first post though. You said your goal was an automatic 5 speed but the Dodge you bought is a manual?
1970 J4000 / Chevy Frankenstein in progress
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

TurboJ4000 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:55 am Are you planning to weld the frame back together or just bolts? The original just riveted together is much different than bolted together.

I would think at the very least it needs to be welded along that seam but a straight vertical weld isnt great for the stresses on a frame either which is why this is often done at an angle and with fish plates to add strength. Looks awesome though I love the body swap idea (hence I'm doing one too).

I am confused by your first post though. You said your goal was an automatic 5 speed but the Dodge you bought is a manual?
I will probably box the frame in at the spliced section and weld it solid, drilling holes where the bolts are so I can periodically check that they are still tight.

The original quest was to find an auto I could just easily bolt on. After researching the topic I saw that there were none, so then I thought just do an adapter. But all said and done, a new trans, an adapter kit to mate the trans to the engine and the transfer case to the new trans (or new transfer case that is native to the trans), cutting and balancing the drive shaft, and running a transmission controller was 10X what I wanted to spend. It was actually MUCH cheaper to just buy used vehicle and do a body swap. I could have just done an engine/trans swap but I wanted the axles, brakes, and HVAC system so a body swap just made more sense. In the process I also got a much better frame as well with out having to piece everything together on the drive-train. Of course I had to piece EVERYTHING else together but its been smooth sailing so far... except the fuel tank abortion... what a mess. As I said before, if I started all over again, I'd just have one custom built or make one myself.

So to answer the question more, I figured if I was going to to a frame swap, I wanted a manual trans. I just like manuals over autos, just my preference.
Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
Gray '88 LS ECU swap project
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

As far as the fuel tank situation, I may put an auxiliary tank where the spare tire used to be. Anyone have a good recommendation? I hear Cheby Blazer tanks or S10 tank works well. I'd have the rear one pump fuel into the front one.
Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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TurboJ4000
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by TurboJ4000 »

Crisd wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 12:09 pm
TurboJ4000 wrote: Tue Jun 22, 2021 10:55 am Are you planning to weld the frame back together or just bolts? The original just riveted together is much different than bolted together.

I would think at the very least it needs to be welded along that seam but a straight vertical weld isnt great for the stresses on a frame either which is why this is often done at an angle and with fish plates to add strength. Looks awesome though I love the body swap idea (hence I'm doing one too).

I am confused by your first post though. You said your goal was an automatic 5 speed but the Dodge you bought is a manual?
I will probably box the frame in at the spliced section and weld it solid, drilling holes where the bolts are so I can periodically check that they are still tight.

The original quest was to find an auto I could just easily bolt on. After researching the topic I saw that there were none, so then I thought just do an adapter. But all said and done, a new trans, an adapter kit to mate the trans to the engine and the transfer case to the new trans (or new transfer case that is native to the trans), cutting and balancing the drive shaft, and running a transmission controller was 10X what I wanted to spend. It was actually MUCH cheaper to just buy used vehicle and do a body swap. I could have just done an engine/trans swap but I wanted the axles, brakes, and HVAC system so a body swap just made more sense. In the process I also got a much better frame as well with out having to piece everything together on the drive-train. Of course I had to piece EVERYTHING else together but its been smooth sailing so far... except the fuel tank abortion... what a mess. As I said before, if I started all over again, I'd just have one custom built or make one myself.

So to answer the question more, I figured if I was going to to a frame swap, I wanted a manual trans. I just like manuals over autos, just my preference.


Makes sense. I love the manuals but driving in traffic is annoying. I have an Nv4500 set up to possibly swap into my truck one day but for now itll be the 4l80. Are you planning to use Vintage air or run the Dodge ac compressor to your system?
1970 J4000 / Chevy Frankenstein in progress
Soon to be Lq4 6.0 and 4l80e on 35s

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Crisd
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

Are you planning to use Vintage air or run the Dodge ac compressor to your system?
[/quote]

No, my plan is as much Dodge stuff as I can. I will install the entire Dodge HVAC unit under the Wagoneer dash. Obviously the seats and trim will all be Wagoneer but all of the chassis, wiring, instrument cluster, switches, HVAC and radio will be Dodge stuff. The windshield wiper motor and wipers will be Wagoneer equipment. The only wiring from the GW will be to the windows and seats. But I plan installing relays in the window wiring, the OEM system sucks. I'm going to run it all onto the Wagoneer metal dashboard and custom fabricate a new face-plate to accept all the Dodge stuff. Then wrap it all in burgundy leather to match the door panels.
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by SJTD »

Used to be that fuel tanks were lead coated, prolly still are. I don't know if it's for anti-sparking or corrosion resistance or both but it sure messes with welding.

Good to use the stock mounting. I can't believe they make aftermarket tanks with welded brackets. I learned this with a glass buggy I built when I welded some mounts on the tank. When I wrecked it they tore the tank open. I'm lucky it didn't ignite. True that this tank was thinner than the aftermarket tanks with the welded mounts but they still scare the elloutta me.
Sic friatur crustulum

'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.

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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

When installing the headers the left header came down and pointed right into the transmission mount cross-member and I didn't like any of the options that kept the exhaust on the left so I cut the header up and turned it 90 degrees about 3/4th of the way down. Once turned the 3" exhaust runs through the saddle between the transmission and the transfer case then makes a 90 degree turn and follows UNDER the right side exhaust down to the muffler (two in/two out) placed in front of the drive shaft rotated 90 degrees so the inlets are not side by side but over/under. Out of the muffler the bottom turns 45 degrees up and to the side of the top outlet and then side by side out the back.
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Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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Green '91 all stock except vacuum hose mod

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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

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Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis

Post by Crisd »

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Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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Green '91 all stock except vacuum hose mod

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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis frame swap

Post by Crisd »

I'm mostly done. I hate stopping what I'm doing to take pictures and I hate getting on the internet, but here's a picture of it driven down the street, if anyone wants to know how I did the rest of it, just let me know and I'll post up the pictures and answer any questions.

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Last edited by Crisd on Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
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Green '91 all stock except vacuum hose mod

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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis frame swap

Post by Crisd »

How do I delete double post?
Last edited by Crisd on Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
Gray '88 LS ECU swap project
Green '91 all stock except vacuum hose mod
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis frame swap

Post by Stuka »

When you gave your original time frame, I admit I was a bit skeptical. But wow, you knocked this out fast!

Do you have plans for a different front bumper setup? Or just going to bob the front part of the frame a bit?
2017 JKU Rubicon
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Crisd
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Re: 88 Waggy on Gen2 Ram 2500 chassis frame swap

Post by Crisd »

I'm not sure about the front frame section, I was considering mounting a winch on that.
Black '88 on shortened Dodge Ram 2500HD chassis
Gray '88 LS ECU swap project
Green '91 all stock except vacuum hose mod
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