GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

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MReno
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GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by MReno »

Hey all,

So I would like to just have a dash switch (original) and an exterior tailgate key raise and lower the window. I also wish to eliminate the other relays, switches, contacts etc. that prevent the tail gate from being opened when the window is up or the window being opened when the tailgate is down.

I figured other may have went this route, so I figured I would ask the question and get some tips?
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dodgerammit
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by dodgerammit »

Ummmm......


Just a dash switch and key switch are the way these things came. Not sure what you are getting at?

Factory has no other relays. The only other switch is the safety switch on the top driver's side of the tailgate where it latches. Bypass that, and you'll be able to raise the glass when gate is opened. Might want to support the glass though......

As far as opening the tailgate with the window up, that is easy. Break the glass. Can be accomplished simply by bypassing the safety switch aforementioned, then raising the glass a little bit with tailgate opened, then slamming tailgate closed.

You'll find many others value their windows, so they have a functioning safety switch if possible. They also went the other route and added relays to the system to improve it.
84 Grand Waggy-Radio Flyer (Garnet Red/3M Ebony Metallic woodgrain, with honey interior) AMC 360 :cry: 2004 4.8LS/Advance Adapter/727/242 D44/AMC20 Serehill tailgate and headlight harnesses :fsj: Ongoing thread-viewtopic.php?t=11897

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sirrus
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by sirrus »

I agree with dodgerammit - the only thing that you can take out is the safety switch and unless it's broken I don't see any reason to do it. Aside from that there just wires, dash and tailgate switches and the motor - that's the whole system

Why do you want to do it anyway? If you're suffering from slow window movement you should think about cleaning the switches, checking wiring and adding relays - makes a lot of difference, believe me
Sometimes we reinvent the wheel not to have more wheels but to have more inventors

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Topic author
MReno
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by MReno »

I guess what I was getting at was trying to avoid having to trace all the wires in the tailgate...to rewire as per original design. But, indeed this is what I should do here, rather than try and cut corners. Thanks for the kick in the butt on being wise....
1989 Jeep Grand Wagoneer
Newbee to owing an old classic that needs some work, but she runs!

Topic author
MReno
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by MReno »

What's "adding relays" all about since I I will be into for complete overhaul. I have the access panel off, glass out, and wires accessible anyways. I confirmed the motor works, but have not yet traced and attempted to return all the wires to the factory configuration. I'll spend some time doing this first.
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tgreese
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by tgreese »

Not familiar with the tailgate wiring per se, but relays are typically added to remove the electrical load from mechanical switches. The relay is slaved to the switch, and its larger contacts takes over the heavy current switching. The switch then only controls the coil of the relay, which is typically a much lower current (20 ma typically). This can either eliminate a lot of smaller gauge wire from the power feed (lowering the power feed resistance), or extend the life of the switch, or both.
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by sirrus »

To add to what tgreese said, I recently started a series of relay upgrades for my waggy and did my tailgate few days ago, you can check details here. Goal is to liven up window movement and prolong life of switches
I'm also starting to make those boxes for sale since there is some interest for them

What is the state of your tailgate wiring? Did PO make some rewiring there or it's broken/rotten?
Sometimes we reinvent the wheel not to have more wheels but to have more inventors

1988 Grand Wagoneer - AMC 360 with ProFlo4 MPFI, TF727, NP229 FOR SALE
2021 JLU Willys EcoDiesel - new shiny toy

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MReno
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by MReno »

Sirrus,
Wiring looks to be unmodified, but faulty (rusted, damaged, missing connectors). I have not tried to trace all of it out yet, separating our the wiper wire(s), license plate light wires, defrost wire, etc.
1989 Jeep Grand Wagoneer
Newbee to owing an old classic that needs some work, but she runs!

Topic author
MReno
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by MReno »

Sirrus- Excellent design for the tailgate relay and eventually I will look to purchase one from you, but cash is tight now so I have to put this on hold and will try to repair original wiring now. thanks for the reply.
1989 Jeep Grand Wagoneer
Newbee to owing an old classic that needs some work, but she runs!

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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by sirrus »

MReno,

Sound like you’re on the right path! Repairing wiring can be tedious and frustrating but there’s no getting around that unfortunately If you’ll decide to install relays later - shoot me a PM
Sometimes we reinvent the wheel not to have more wheels but to have more inventors

1988 Grand Wagoneer - AMC 360 with ProFlo4 MPFI, TF727, NP229 FOR SALE
2021 JLU Willys EcoDiesel - new shiny toy
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dodgerammit
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by dodgerammit »

Look around the bottom of the tailgate where the wiring loom runs through hole. Very common area for breaks due to constant bending from opening and closing. Also, I have serehill's relay schematics if you feel adventurous and want to build your own system. However, Sirrus' stuff looks more compact and would be less than parts alone for the serehill job.
84 Grand Waggy-Radio Flyer (Garnet Red/3M Ebony Metallic woodgrain, with honey interior) AMC 360 :cry: 2004 4.8LS/Advance Adapter/727/242 D44/AMC20 Serehill tailgate and headlight harnesses :fsj: Ongoing thread-viewtopic.php?t=11897

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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by sirrus »

I have to mention that my system relies on factory wiring coming into tailgate (including always hot 12V wire) unlike serehill's one which included new wire from battery to tailgate. Just two different approaches for the same problem, each with their own pros and cons :)
Sometimes we reinvent the wheel not to have more wheels but to have more inventors

1988 Grand Wagoneer - AMC 360 with ProFlo4 MPFI, TF727, NP229 FOR SALE
2021 JLU Willys EcoDiesel - new shiny toy
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dodgerammit
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by dodgerammit »

sirrus wrote: Fri Mar 13, 2020 11:26 am I have to mention that my system relies on factory wiring coming into tailgate (including always hot 12V wire) unlike serehill's one which included new wire from battery to tailgate. Just two different approaches for the same problem, each with their own pros and cons :)
If the wiring is still pliable and the coating isn't stiff and cracked, the wiring should still be okay to do what you did.

Serehill's setup ran lots of 12 gauge for the power feed, which technically is better. Especially if replacing, stepping up in gauge is usually a good idea.
84 Grand Waggy-Radio Flyer (Garnet Red/3M Ebony Metallic woodgrain, with honey interior) AMC 360 :cry: 2004 4.8LS/Advance Adapter/727/242 D44/AMC20 Serehill tailgate and headlight harnesses :fsj: Ongoing thread-viewtopic.php?t=11897

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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by sirrus »

Factory wiring for the tailgate window is all 12 gauge so there’s no stepping up gauge-wise.

And if it’s cracked or corroded it should be replaced - but that’s a different story. I wouldn’t say my solution is harness, while serehill’s one definitely is.
Sometimes we reinvent the wheel not to have more wheels but to have more inventors

1988 Grand Wagoneer - AMC 360 with ProFlo4 MPFI, TF727, NP229 FOR SALE
2021 JLU Willys EcoDiesel - new shiny toy
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dodgerammit
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by dodgerammit »

sirrus wrote: Sat Mar 14, 2020 7:48 am Factory wiring for the tailgate window is all 12 gauge so there’s no stepping up gauge-wise.

And if it’s cracked or corroded it should be replaced - but that’s a different story. I wouldn’t say my solution is harness, while serehill’s one definitely is.
In that case he may have ran 10. I do know when I pulled my old stuff out, his main feeds were larger.
It also may have been better insulation. His wire coating was definitely some of the most pliable I've seen on new wiring.
84 Grand Waggy-Radio Flyer (Garnet Red/3M Ebony Metallic woodgrain, with honey interior) AMC 360 :cry: 2004 4.8LS/Advance Adapter/727/242 D44/AMC20 Serehill tailgate and headlight harnesses :fsj: Ongoing thread-viewtopic.php?t=11897

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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by sirrus »

Then it was probably 10 gauge with silicone insulation - that is really pliable, I used a lot of it on my drones for power feeds.

Just to be clear - I’m not saying that serehills harness is bad or that mine is the silver bullet. They are different solutions with different scope.

Mine is geared more toward using factory wires (where adequate), minimal modifications and keeping it compact. Think of it as an add-on. If your power feed is rotten - two relays won’t fix it, it needs to be replaced.

On the other hand, Serehills harness is a complete rewire for tailgate window, with new power feed, remote and everything. That is really good and will solve almost every problem - you’re literally replacing all the wiring for the system. I feel that may be an overkill if wiring was not gone.

Hope I’ve made my point clear.
Sometimes we reinvent the wheel not to have more wheels but to have more inventors

1988 Grand Wagoneer - AMC 360 with ProFlo4 MPFI, TF727, NP229 FOR SALE
2021 JLU Willys EcoDiesel - new shiny toy
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pacific541
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by pacific541 »

Sirrus,

I am down in Eugene, how can I get a hold of you? apparently I can't send a PM on this forum. I am interested in talking tail gate harness.
thanks,
Jeremy
1989 Grand Wagoneer
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Holley Sniper EFI-removed went back to carb...loving it!
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by sirrus »

pacific541 wrote: Tue Feb 01, 2022 9:13 am Sirrus,

I am down in Eugene, how can I get a hold of you? apparently I can't send a PM on this forum. I am interested in talking tail gate harness.
thanks,
Jeremy
I've just been to Eugene a day ago :) Sent you a PM with my contact info!
Sometimes we reinvent the wheel not to have more wheels but to have more inventors

1988 Grand Wagoneer - AMC 360 with ProFlo4 MPFI, TF727, NP229 FOR SALE
2021 JLU Willys EcoDiesel - new shiny toy
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pacific541
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Re: GW Tailgate Window Switch Modification

Post by pacific541 »

thanks! I shot you an email
1989 Grand Wagoneer
Jasper 360 Crate motor
Holley Sniper EFI-removed went back to carb...loving it!
Custom Exhaust
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