Rear End Rub/Rub/Rub noise when Turning

[CBJoe]

Nope....not fixed. If I'm not mistaken the above testing verified that its not stuck in e-drive (eg. it will switch on/off indicated by light on dash and behavior with only front driveshaft installed).

Sorry about the rattly jeep...but its still missing a lot of its interior and needs spring bushings. But you can distinctly hear the rub/rub or thunk/thunk at slow speed turns. Its pretty dramatic and noticeable towards the end.

So is this stick slip? Or does my transfer case have a big issue. Better audio towards end of video

https://youtu.be/VISmH20JMcs

[CBJoe]

I hate asking this...but is it correct that the rear driveshaft slip joint should be positioned at the transfer case end or at the rear axle?

When I got the jeep it was like this with the slip joint at qtrac end.

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[devildog80]

Time to get a driver, and you jump in the back to listen to the floor with a piece of pipe to your ear.

See if it is transfer case, or is it rear diff?

Have driver go real slow, and you either walking behind or on a bicycle, follow while they drive to observe each rear wheel and sounds.

Drive near a wall if you can, and see what sounds are more noticeable on DS or PS.

With it making the noise only in slow tight turns, would lead me to LS diff issue, or possibly a rear axle outer bearing.

Pull your rear drums, and make sure you do not have a brake assy possible coming apart inside.

Just some thoughts, and where I would look if it were mine.

[devildog80]

Growing up on farm/ranch, the female end of the tube ALWAYS faced to the rear, so anything like water that might get past the male slip, would drain out.

With the female end facing the TC, like you show it is now, it will retain water down in the driveshaft tube.

Simple condensation can create moisture inside it too.

[devildog80]

NEVER NEVER NEVER apologize for how YOUR Jeep looks or sounds to anyone else.

It is yours to enjoy, however you want, not ours

Nope....not fixed. If I'm not mistaken the above testing verified that its not stuck in e-drive (eg. it will switch on/off indicated by light on dash and behavior with only front driveshaft installed).

Sorry about the rattly jeep...but its still missing a lot of its interior and needs spring bushings. But you can distinctly hear the rub/rub or thunk/thunk at slow speed turns. Its pretty dramatic and noticeable towards the end.

So is this stick slip? Or does my transfer case have a big issue. Better audio towards end of video

https://youtu.be/VISmH20JMcs

[CBJoe]

I'm gonna break out the magnetic mount GoPro tomorrow and will try and take a vid at the diff and at the qtrac output to narrow down. I dont think its axle bearing/brake related as there was zero noise when driving with the rear driveshaft removed.

I suppose the diff would behave different with no load on it. But I checked the diff and there was no metal in the fluid and the backlash and gear pattern looked good. So hard to believe a diff issue like that would appear only at slow speed turning. BUT.....I'm for sure still a FNG with troubleshooting diff/drivetrain issues

[Yeller]

I hate asking this...but is it correct that the rear driveshaft slip joint should be positioned at the transfer case end or at the rear axle?

When I got the jeep it was like this with the slip joint at qtrac end.

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My driveshaft shop that I’ve asked and all OEM’s that I’ve observed install the shaft just as you have with the slip at the transmission or transfer case. I usually install them with the slip at differential because it will stand up to being drug over rocks better than the tube.

[devildog80]

Maybe not, just throwing out possibilities to check, and the GoPro is probably the best tool to use for the investigating right now.

You're getting closer

[Stuka]

I can't recall, have you tested it with just the rear drive shaft while in e-drive? That would identify if it was the t-case or the rear diff.

As for the drive shaft orientation, personally I would never run it with the slip on the axle side because way too much road debris will end up hitting the slip, which will start to pit it. Also, having the slip on the axle side will make it more likely to have vibrations. There is a reason every single OEM has always had the slip up by the t-case.

Growing up on farm/ranch, the female end of the tube ALWAYS faced to the rear, so anything like water that might get past the male slip, would drain out.

With the female end facing the TC, like you show it is now, it will retain water down in the driveshaft tube.

Simple condensation can create moisture inside it too.

I think you have this backwards. With the OEM orientation, the female side is facing down, which is how he has it now. The male side is welded to the main drive shaft.

[CBJoe]

I have not tried with only the rear driveshaft. I did try with only the front. Correct me if I'm wrong though, but since I already verified that there was no noise with only the front in e-drive. Wouldn't I accomplish the same by then running both front/rear in E-Drive?

[Stuka]

I have not tried with only the rear driveshaft. I did try with only the front. Correct me if I'm wrong though, but since I already verified that there was no noise with only the front in e-drive. Wouldn't I accomplish the same by then running both front/rear in E-Drive?

Often when a differential goes bad, it will only make noise when load is applied to it.

You could do a similar test with both drive shafts connected if you have a gravel or loose dirt area, and you do the turns in e-drive with both drive shafts. It needs to be gravel or loose dirt to help prevent any binding. If the noise is gone there, it points even more at the t-case being the issue.

[CBJoe]

Got it....i'm pretty sure I can find loose gravel near me.

[devildog80]

It could be correct, as the top end is hidden.

Looked at pics on my rig here, it is working as I described, and looks his is correct as shown too. My female end is on TC, with open end towards the rear. Yes the male end is welded to the longer tube of the system.

20220416_125946 by Scott Weckerly, on Flickr

I can't recall, have you tested it with just the rear drive shaft while in e-drive? That would identify if it was the t-case or the rear diff.

As for the drive shaft orientation, personally I would never run it with the slip on the axle side because way too much road debris will end up hitting the slip, which will start to pit it. Also, having the slip on the axle side will make it more likely to have vibrations. There is a reason every single OEM has always had the slip up by the t-case.

Growing up on farm/ranch, the female end of the tube ALWAYS faced to the rear, so anything like water that might get past the male slip, would drain out.

With the female end facing the TC, like you show it is now, it will retain water down in the driveshaft tube.

Simple condensation can create moisture inside it too.

I think you have this backwards. With the OEM orientation, the female side is facing down, which is how he has it now. The male side is welded to the main drive shaft.

[Yeller]

Technically you do have the driveshaft installed correctly.

[Pair O J10]

So only when hot and only when turning??....sounds like the diff to me....stick slip is a violent action caused as you know by the cones sticking....Is it a violent JUMP or just a noise?...The diff only "diff's" if you will, while turning ...cold oil ie THICK oil in the diff lubricates pretty well ...hot oil THIN not so much...drive the truck with the case in "E" drive in fiqure 8's in "dirt" or very loose ground after the diff is hot ...still hear it?...

[CBJoe]

Ok....so I took Stukas advice and found a crushed gravel parking lot at local race track. The noise 100% disappears when E-Drive is engaged. I did some GoPro Vids to back it up. I believe this 100% tells me its the QTrack Cones Sticking.

Here's a vid with some nice audio of the noise and how it disappears with the E-Drive engaged.

https://youtu.be/a76yO5QOMuY

When I got the jeep a few months ago I Drained all the old fluid from the Qtrac and the low range unit and filled with the Crown Fluid from BJs. I checked the chain slack and it was very well within tolerance. I've done probably 20mins of figure 8s to no avail. It seems to get worse with heat. I need to consider next steps.

Thanks for bearing with me everyone. I hope this thread and the videos will help other newbies such as me come to quicker conclusions.

Cheers, Joe

[devildog80]

It does help a lot, and thanks for keeping us updated.

Following to see what the solution is found to be

[Pair O J10]

Well you can add more friction modifier to the oil, I'd add another 4 oz and give it a go....short of that you may have galled cones and center diff that's equally galled up. I should have read all the posts didn't see Stukas suggestion....sorry

[CBJoe]

No worries...at this point I'll try the additive first.

I see I can get a chain rebuild kit and cones from BJs for around 700$

Trying to decide if I'll dig into it myself or find a local shop that knows qtracs.





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[Stuka]

No worries...at this point I'll try the additive first.

I see I can get a chain rebuild kit and cones from BJs for around 700$

Trying to decide if I'll dig into it myself or find a local shop that knows qtracs.

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I think finding a shop that has experience with QTs these days is going to be tough. I am sure there are some old timers that still work at shops. But most probably wont even know what a QT is.

Doesn't mean they cant perfectly rebuild it. But if you think you can do it, I say its worth trying. There is some good write-ups and some videos out there on how to rebuild them.