74 Cherokee wiring bulkhead to engine compartment

[dturnersr]

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So the Cherokee came to with some ails. The waterpump was half off, and some other obvious woes; such as age and shade tree repairs. I swapped the water pump, heater hoses, lower radiator hose, rubber fuel lines, fuel filter, p/s return line and new belts.

Onto the engine wiring harness. I've rewired and repaired the burnt wires, broken insulation wires and obvious wire nuts etc. I've review the ammeter schematic and wiring diagram. In the picture the wire without insulation and orange looking maybe brown wire above go to the same bulkhead terminal I believe to be 13a. It's the only dual lead on the schematic. In the diagram it list the colors as red w/tr. The same as circuit 13 and 75 which feeds coil and fuse block as well. This is the wire lead that was wired to the power feed to the HEI. According to the s schematic the return feed is a resistance pink wire...which is long gone. I am thinking the new feed goes to the starter solenoid lead any help would be appreciated. Also I can't figure out what the yellow wire lead goes to? But I also have a key cylinder and ignition switch concern as the key does nothing it feels like the actuator rod is off or not there haven't got that far yet. With the battery hot the yellow wire has no voltage.

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This is what I started with..

[runuover86gw]

The yellow wire, if you are referring to the one next to violet/purple and above the blue with white tracer should be for your washer pump. The dual lead wire you are speaking of, on the engine side, originally the two wires went to the positive of the coil and from the positive of that coil it went to the starter solenoid. The other wire went to the vacuum solenoid switch, which then jumpered over to the throttle stop solenoid. Inside the cab it went to a splice and one end of the splice went to the fuse box and the other end went to the ignition switch.

[tgreese]

The bulkhead connector layout is given on the wiring diagram here. https://oljeep.com/gw/elec/74/74_FSJ_Wi ... mPage1.jpg The wiring diagrams are also presented here - https://oljeep.com/edge_74_tsm.html - along with the wiring diagrams. These seem to be the same diagrams from a different phototransfer.

I don't see where the conflict is. It either is or is not 13A. Certainly I would pick away the putty from the outside of the connector so I could see where the wires actually go. The locations on the connector are numbered, and these numbers correspond to both the numbers of the paths on the diagram, and the circuits described in the legend. There is a lot of information on this diagram if you know how to read it and you are methodical in tracing the wires.

If it's overwhelming to look at the diagram, I suggest you make a photocopy double-size and tape all the sheets together. Then use colored pencils to trace out each circuit as you follow it on the diagram and on the car.

If you need help with the steering column, the later manuals (ca 1982?) also on that site have very good step-by-step instructions for exploring the ignition switch region. This is a standard GM column, and the switch is down at the base of the column, connected by a rod to the key mechanism.

[dturnersr]

I was using those two references given thanks for the links I have the saved and printed both out. There was ko insulation left on the 15 garage wire even under to the connector spade, the other looks orange to me but it could have been red also but I don't see any tracer. Both ohm to the same spade connector my housing are not number on either side except to the fuse block which because of the ignition switch issue will have to resolved first. I am a former Ford certified tech back in the 80's so I'm very familiar with working wiring etc, Fords EVTM we're substantially better to work with. That yellow wire got me for no as there is no reference to it for any reference I've seen. Once I get the ignition switch concern resolved I'll figure it out. I understand how the pink resistance wire was invented for the point set up but it's really irrelevant for the HEI.

[tgreese]

Dunno, the shape of the connector seems sufficient to me. You understand that the drawing maps to the wire locations, not to the actual printed numbers on the connector? Possible there are numbers on the connector you can see if you use enough light and magnification. These will just number the pins, not relate to the Jeep wire drawings.

If you have the orientation right and are looking at the correct side, there are wire locations with missing connectors that would key to the drawing. The later bulkhead connectors (BTDT) have a shape that is unambiguous in rotation, maybe not these earlier bulkheads. Still, the plane of the connectors and the layout of filled and missing pins should be enough.

Jeep used a single-strand nichrome wire for the later applications with a ballast wire, and I would expect the points ignition to have this too. This might help you identify the remains of the ballast wire connection. You should be able to use that pin for your HEI connection, maybe through a relay powered from the solenoid. It should have power in both start and run. There is also a connection to the coil from the I terminal of the starter solenoid that bypasses the resistor at starting.

[dturnersr]

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After some more digging, pulling the fire wall bulkhead connector. The wire from the engine side which to me looked orange or brown actually was red with black tracer, the ignition and fuse block lead. However, it was burnt on the inside also. I also found the same red wire feeds to ignition switch as the last 8" was previously repaired. I am still trying put together the why; what caused that wire to get hot. I thing it may have to due with the steering lock and key cylinder not work as the actuator rod would not move when the key was turned. I think the ignition switch failed in the start position. I pulled the ignition switch and disassembled it not finding anything obviously wrong. However, the key lock issue found the issue. A made in China 70s part failed.

Trying to source a replacement now.

[dturnersr]

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[dturnersr]

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[Swbtwo]

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Pardon my ignorance, but what’s that?

[dturnersr]

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It's the rack for the ignition rod to ignition switch, which is mated to the lock sector.

[dturnersr]

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[tgreese]

The heat shrink is good. The ammeter connection in these cars is know to be a source of dash fires. The red wire comes from the alternator through the bulkhead, through the ammeter and back through the bulkhead to the battery. Bypassing the ammeter and replacing it with a voltmeter is a common upgrade. There is no reason to send that red wire to the dash without the ammeter.

The '80s TSMs have a much better description of the column and ignition lock assembly than the '70s books. Same GM column. Maybe worth a look on the Tom Collins site. That broken part should be available from Chevrolet or from a junkyard GM column.

[dturnersr]

The heat shrink is good. The ammeter connection in these cars is know to be a source of dash fires. The red wire comes from the alternator through the bulkhead, through the ammeter and back through the bulkhead to the battery. Bypassing the ammeter and replacing it with a voltmeter is a common upgrade. There is no reason to send that red wire to the dash without the ammeter.

The '80s TSMs have a much better description of the column and ignition lock assembly than the '70s books. Same GM column. Maybe worth a look on the Tom Collins site. That broken part should be available from Chevrolet or from a junkyard GM column.

Thanks Tim,

I was able to source a replacement kit locally. Even though all the descriptions said it was not a fit.

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After figuring it was a GM column I knew it would fit. The problem was the actuator rod was badly bent out shape. Instead of laying in the Grove at the top and the other 90 degree pointing up at the mount position for the ignition switch it was all jacked around it took some time to bend it back just right to lay in the slot/groove and to point up at the bottom and it need a slight dog leg bend just above the switch.

I've been reading about the ammeter delete. Could some one link a voltage gauge source replacement and looks like I will need a temperature guage also.

I'll also be needing the heater cable from the control head to the heater core box as this one is cooked. If any has a source.

I also notice that it appears I'm missing two of the black plastic bulb bodies. I did replace all the others while I had the cluster out. I had to repair the center plastic lens back to the body as it was loose


Now it starts with the key, so next is to repair the cracks in the steering wheel and install the new turn signal switch. My focus is to get everything working first mechanically and then rip it all back apart for the body restoration work. Fortunately, just a few tumors as the Jeep was from Arizona.

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[runuover86gw]

The heat shrink is good. The ammeter connection in these cars is know to be a source of dash fires. The red wire comes from the alternator through the bulkhead, through the ammeter and back through the bulkhead to the battery. Bypassing the ammeter and replacing it with a voltmeter is a common upgrade. There is no reason to send that red wire to the dash without the ammeter.

The '80s TSMs have a much better description of the column and ignition lock assembly than the '70s books. Same GM column. Maybe worth a look on the Tom Collins site. That broken part should be available from Chevrolet or from a junkyard GM column.

Thanks Tim,

I was able to source a replacement kit locally. Even though all the descriptions said it was not a fit.


Screenshot_20211016-172412_Chrome.jpg

After figuring it was a GM column I knew it would fit. The problem was the actuator rod was badly bent out shape. Instead of laying in the Grove at the top and the other 90 degree pointing up at the mount position for the ignition switch it was all jacked around it took some time to bend it back just right to lay in the slot/groove and to point up at the bottom and it need a slight dog leg bend just above the switch.

I've been reading about the ammeter delete. Could some one link a voltage gauge source replacement and looks like I will need a temperature guage also.

I'll also be needing the heater cable from the control head to the heater core box as this one is cooked. If any has a source.

I also notice that it appears I'm missing two of the black plastic bulb bodies. I did replace all the others while I had the cluster out. I had to repair the center plastic lens back to the body as it was loose


Now it starts with the key, so next is to repair the cracks in the steering wheel and install the new turn signal switch. My focus is to get everything working first mechanically and then rip it all back apart for the body restoration work. Fortunately, just a few tumors as the Jeep was from Arizona.20211018_180648.jpg


20211019_110755.jpg

I have two temperature gauges. I would just need to bench check them to make sure one of them is good. It is something I have been meaning to get around to anyways. And I know I have some spare bulb sockets. I just would need to check to see if they are the right size. I am tied up tonight working on some projects for some of my customers, but I should be able to go out to the garage after my day job tomorrow and check for those parts. I will PM you my email address, so just in case I get distracted working on customer's projects before checking. And you could give me a little reminder if you don't mind.

[dturnersr]

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I appreciate they offer for the bulb holders.looks like they are not used. I'm looking forward to my hard copy of the manual

[tgreese]

Check page 1L-41 and forward in the '82 TSM at the Tom Collins site. Much better coverage of this.

[runuover86gw]

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I appreciate they offer for the bulb holders.looks like they are not used. I'm looking forward to my hard copy of the manual

No problem at all. Were you still looking for the gauge? I pulled them both off the clusters last night, but I didn't get a chance to bench test either one, because I was up most of the night working on a customer's project that I am trying to get ready by tomorrow or this weekend. Actually trying to get three projects finished up this weekend, so I have been putting in some long nights.

[dturnersr]

Yes I think I still need both a temp guage and voltage to replace the ammeter

[runuover86gw]

Yes I think I still need both a temp guage and voltage to replace the ammeter

I am sure I can help you out with the temp gauge, but probably not so much the voltmeter right now. I plan some time in the future, hopefully the beginning of the year or earlier to quit my full time day job to focus fully on my business. When that happens, I can start doing R&D and developing some of the many products I have in my sketch pad. A user friendly ammeter to voltmeter conversion kit is in my sketch pad among many other things. I just don't have time for it right now. Hopefully I should be getting off work in a little over an hour and I can bench test both of those gauges and then give a look at the insides to make sure all the components look ok and nothing needs to be replaced. After that I can send you some pictures if you message me your email. Thank you. Josh

[tgreese]

The voltmeter everyone uses is this Sunpro - https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002 ... UTF8&psc=1

It pivots down, and can go into the original cluster if you remove the case and make some easy mods.

Search here and at IFSJA and you'll find lots of threads https://www.bing.com/search?q=site%3Aif ... +voltmeter

Amazon says it's not available, but I found at least one seller on eBay. Walmart says it's available.