Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

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thej10guy
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Location: Holmen Wisconsin 54636

Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by thej10guy » Tue Jan 24, 2023 10:30 am

Ok I have a question for you all. So for my 83 j10, as I’m fixing it up I’m changing the doors. The doors (factory to the truck) are pretty rusty but I got a set of about ‘65 waggy front doors with the truck.

Can I put the later wing windows in the earlier doors so that my new gaskets will work?

Will my later interior door handles work on the earlier doors? Are the mounting holes in different spots?

Other suggestions and things I need to be aware of for the door swap that I didn’t mention?


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1983 Jeep J10 Honcho SWB 5.3 4l60E NP241C viewtopic.php?f=12&t=22361
1979 Jeep J10 LWB (project/parts truck)
1989 GMC Jimmy (project)
Jeep Lover for life :fsj:


sierrablue
Posts: 317
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:02 pm
Location: MN

Re: Early FSJ door vs. old FSJ door

Post by sierrablue » Tue Jan 24, 2023 2:26 pm

Wing wondows will bolt right in, and the door handles will work fine.

The one thing that won't work is the door latches. They changed them in mid-1978, and I dunno about the door side, but the post side has a totally different bolt pattern and can't be swapped. Next time I'm in the garage I can check if the latch bolt pattern is the same or not there.

Also, your '65 door won't have speaker mounts and the access hole will be different, and it may not have the holes to mount your power window stuff. It won't have the access hole for the wires for power windows/locks/speakers, and at some point they moved the upper door panel metal strip up--I dunno when that was but I suspect yours has the taller one.

Pretty sure the only dealbreaker would be the latch mounting though.
'71 Wagoneer, Daily Driver
-B350 (HEI, iron 4-barrel, Edelbrock 1406), TH400, D20
-open knuckle D44 front (non-power discs)
-custom headliner
-Front shoulder belts (rears too when I build the brackets)

"Remember when he had a two-track mind? Now he just has a narrow track mind."--Mom, a few months after I got the '71


letank
Posts: 3744
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Location: SF bay area

Re: Early FSJ door vs. old FSJ door

Post by letank » Tue Jan 24, 2023 2:55 pm

you can swap your door latches from the 83 to the 65 doors, you will need to drill extra holes... I did the opposite, newer doors 80's onto 74 older frame

the latch is deeper on the rear door for the 80's, there is divot on the 80's door, at least the rear ones, which is what I worked on

Image

Image

the door key locks barrel are different too

the issue could be if you want to swap the electric windows on the manual doors, more holes and brackets placements.
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits , Fuel and brake lines, Body work, Trany and TC


sierrablue
Posts: 317
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:02 pm
Location: MN

Re: Early FSJ door vs. old FSJ door

Post by sierrablue » Tue Jan 24, 2023 3:23 pm

The cylinders are different, but they go into the same hole--I have one newer one and one older one on the '71. I don't have a key for the older one :roll:
'71 Wagoneer, Daily Driver
-B350 (HEI, iron 4-barrel, Edelbrock 1406), TH400, D20
-open knuckle D44 front (non-power discs)
-custom headliner
-Front shoulder belts (rears too when I build the brackets)

"Remember when he had a two-track mind? Now he just has a narrow track mind."--Mom, a few months after I got the '71

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thej10guy
Posts: 261
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2022 10:06 am
Location: Holmen Wisconsin 54636

Re: Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by thej10guy » Tue Jan 24, 2023 5:14 pm

Thanks for that info guys! That is good news. I was a little worried about the wing windows since I bought all new gaskets, and the wing window gaskets work for 78+ or whatever it is. I already have manual windows so I should be fine there in those regards. The door latch seems simple enough.

What about the interior door handles/pulls? I have a set for the later doors but I do not have a set for the early doors since the ones that were on the early ones were junk. Will my newer style ones still bolt on? I’m wondering because the door handles bj’s offroad sells are for the early ones and says it will work on newer doors but something is different about them.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
1983 Jeep J10 Honcho SWB 5.3 4l60E NP241C viewtopic.php?f=12&t=22361
1979 Jeep J10 LWB (project/parts truck)
1989 GMC Jimmy (project)
Jeep Lover for life :fsj:


sierrablue
Posts: 317
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:02 pm
Location: MN

Re: Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by sierrablue » Tue Jan 24, 2023 6:09 pm

As far as I can tell they'll fit. I can double check tomorrow with an '80s armrest, but the mid-'70s style armrests definitely work with the Kaiser doors.

Now, IMO the older ones are better, but that's a totally different convo; doesn't have anything to do with what does/doesn't work :-bd
'71 Wagoneer, Daily Driver
-B350 (HEI, iron 4-barrel, Edelbrock 1406), TH400, D20
-open knuckle D44 front (non-power discs)
-custom headliner
-Front shoulder belts (rears too when I build the brackets)

"Remember when he had a two-track mind? Now he just has a narrow track mind."--Mom, a few months after I got the '71


sansabarJ
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:40 pm

Re: Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by sansabarJ » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:39 pm

Ok door swaps , The early 60s door uses weatherstripping ON the door and not the jam so those doors are different . Then later doors up to 78 (the last year of the early latch type ) the doors are just about 3/8" thinner in width " AMC " change, and use a wider thicker door seal up to 91last model year . So the weatherstrip definitely will be an issue on 65 door or any door before 78 . Door seals from any vendor that tell us they fit on pre78 vehicles including telling you to readjust the door or slam them etc etc , not going to work do to the doors are not identical . Not sure the exact years from 65 onward when Kaiser
started installing the weatherstripping on the door jam , so far that weatherstripping is not available anyplace so far as I know . The weatherstripping has the windlace as part of those seals . For this exact reason I'd try to find nicer doors and not swap anything to get them to fit up .

SansabarJ


sierrablue
Posts: 317
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:02 pm
Location: MN

Re: Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by sierrablue » Sat Jan 28, 2023 10:56 am

The '71 has the gaskets on the body, not on the door, with the exception of the tailgate. Pretty sure that change was somewhere in the '68-'70 range. But that just means it has a couple more holes in it; not a big deal.

I realize the gaskets aren't 100% "right", but I got the BJ's gaskets and they work fine. The driver's door adjusted pretty much perfectly, the passenger's front doesn't line up 100% perfectly in its hole anyway, and the rears are only bad because the aftermarket door panels have trim that sticks out into the gasket area. If that weren't there they would work as they should.

Also, it's ok (even ideal) if the gaskets are initially a little big, as the rubber is going to shrink over time, so if it's too big to start with, over time it's going to last a lot longer. Nobody wants to spend $140 on new door gaskets every 5 years.
'71 Wagoneer, Daily Driver
-B350 (HEI, iron 4-barrel, Edelbrock 1406), TH400, D20
-open knuckle D44 front (non-power discs)
-custom headliner
-Front shoulder belts (rears too when I build the brackets)

"Remember when he had a two-track mind? Now he just has a narrow track mind."--Mom, a few months after I got the '71


sansabarJ
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:40 pm

Re: Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by sansabarJ » Tue Jan 31, 2023 1:17 pm

Your lucky there if you got the doors to shut without having to slam or move door out a lot. I bought BJs seals and sold them . To your point sierrablue , if seals were to become squeezed down over time over many years they work well . I installed 80 wagoneer used nice seals from my local wrecking yard , they are 40 years old. They are compressed about half of what a new door seal is . The doors seal tightly , no water or air leaks . I have to shut doors firmly to close and have not needed to do any adjusting of the door which I prefer. I have two 80 front doors here in CA . One perfect , one has a crease in middle of door. No rust at all . I had listed them in for sale section a year back or so if any interest .


sierrablue
Posts: 317
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2022 8:02 pm
Location: MN

Re: Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by sierrablue » Tue Jan 31, 2023 5:24 pm

I mean, I had to adjust the plates and the doors, and like I said, since the rear doors have some wrong trim on then, they can be a pain, but the doors were taken off when it was repainted anyway, so they weren't adjusted. Additionally, my Jeep has been in an accident at some point, so the doors don't line up square in the holes no matter what you do.

It's great that you found used gaskets that work, but there are only so many of those left. And as rubber dries, it shrinks, so eventually we're going to be out of original seals that actually do any good. I'm just saying that since he's a high schooler who plans to keep his truck forever, it's gonna be best to just put new gaskets on now.
'71 Wagoneer, Daily Driver
-B350 (HEI, iron 4-barrel, Edelbrock 1406), TH400, D20
-open knuckle D44 front (non-power discs)
-custom headliner
-Front shoulder belts (rears too when I build the brackets)

"Remember when he had a two-track mind? Now he just has a narrow track mind."--Mom, a few months after I got the '71


sansabarJ
Posts: 146
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:40 pm

Re: Early FSJ door vs. new FSJ door

Post by sansabarJ » Tue Jan 31, 2023 6:29 pm

I can see what your saying . It's great you got those to work out for you . Your right we have few options on these vintage rigs so we do what we can .

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