Reversed front springs

[surfwagoneer]

So I know there are a couple of guys running with their front springs reversed. I'd like to do this to the chief I'm working on. So my question is there any mods to the steering that need to be made to accomplish this?

[BigJ200]

It depends on how you build it. I've built dozens and sometimes the tie rod interferes with the spring. Rarely. Usually it can be remedied by adding a bit more caster.

The other bigger issue is to make sure your front driveshaft has enough compression travel. If it doesn't, you will put a window in your transfer case. This is because the axle now moves backward as the suspension compresses.

And the best way to do a shackle reversal is to keep the spring as close to the frame as possible. Too many guys weld the rear pivot to the bottom of the frame. Hole saw through the frame and weld in 1.75"x.120" wall tubing then use YJ spring bushings or similar. Make sure you only tack the front anchor in place until you verify that the shackle angle is at about 30 degrees with all the weight on the suspension. This will ensure that it does not flip forward when the suspension droops.

Remember to move the front axle forward 1-2" as well. This will keep the tire from smashing into your fender.

Hope this helps.

[GWag89]

I think the op was asking about flipping the spring to make use of the offset spring pin to gain wheel base and improve approach angle. The shackle will stay on the front... If I understand the question correctly

[BigJ200]

I think you're right. Early morning response with brain un-coffeed!

[surfwagoneer]

I think the op was asking about flipping the spring to make use of the offset spring pin to gain wheel base and improve approach angle. The shackle will stay on the front... If I understand the question correctly

Right on. Sorry should have clarified that. This chief will be predominantly a wheeler and I'd like to stretch out and get that extra two inches.

[GWag89]

I've also considered this option that is why I understood what you were saying. I'm running 4" lift springs sua. from what I can tell it will turn the pinion down slightly. That can easily be corrected by a longer front shackle which points the pinion up. Both the spring flip and the longer shackle should neutralize the pinion angle or at least help you get it close by using shackle length to tune your Pinon after the spring flip

[surfwagoneer]

I was also curious how it affected the steering box and drag link after pushing it forward. The pinion angle could definitely be a problem as I might be retaining SUA for the time being as I am still running the QT and don't have my hands on a cheap flat top knuckle for cross over.

[AwesomeJ10]

I run rancho rs44044 springs reversed with SOA on a D60 with high steer. Everything clears fine and I'm running the stock pitman/j20 box.

I feel that because I'm running them reversed, they have a tendency to bend/break as I've done so many times.

[surfwagoneer]

I run rancho rs44044 springs reversed with SOA on a D60 with high steer. Everything clears fine and I'm running the stock pitman/j20 box.

I feel that because I'm running them reversed, they have a tendency to bend/break as I've done so many times.

I was hoping to hear from you Blake. Thanks for the input. I have read about you breaking springs and would be willing to run that risk. I'll make sure to carry some extra springs on wheeling trips. My main concern was any steering changes that I may encounter so its good to hear that its as simple as flipping the springs around. I'm still debating going SOA right now for mult reasons....still running the QT, price of a cross over set up, $$$, blah blah blah. Just want to get this thing on the trail as soon as possible with the best capabilities as possible. I run with a pretty modified D2 and TJ both with lots of flex and locked front and rear so I need to make sure I'm not holding them up too much. Thanks again for the feed back

[AwesomeJ10]

.....I run with a pretty modified D2 and TJ both with lots of flex and locked front and rear so I need to make sure I'm not holding them up too much. Thanks again for the feed back

well then you need to go SOA.

Start out by seeing if anyone local to you can mill a pair of flat top knuckles. If so, then grab some flat tops from the junkyard and have them milled. If not, then you must fork out the $$$ for some flat tops that are already milled and drilled for high steer arms.

There is an Ebay seller that I've used a few times who sells some cheap high steer arms, studs, TRE's etc as a kit. http://www.ebay.com/usr/greatautodeals? ... 2749.l2754 I've bought several kits from him and now have 100% spare stuff for my Honcho and wife's YJ (SOA). I think he even sells the knuckles too, but they are mega $$$.

[AwesomeJ10]

on another note... I recently built a '78 D44 HP 8 lug with flat tops, high steer, brakes, locker, new bearings, 5.38 gears, etc. By the time I was done, I feel silly cause I now have a ton of $$$ tied up into that little D44.

I'm starting to eyeball the Ford D60 front axles from the '99 and up super dutys in the junkyard and feel that the next time I build axles, it will be with those ford D60's. I wish they had the normal 8 lug pattern tho.

[Stuka]

on another note... I recently built a '78 D44 HP 8 lug with flat tops, high steer, brakes, locker, new bearings, 5.38 gears, etc. By the time I was done, I feel silly cause I now have a ton of $$$ tied up into that little D44.

I'm starting to eyeball the Ford D60 front axles from the '99 and up super dutys in the junkyard and feel that the next time I build axles, it will be with those ford D60's. I wish they had the normal 8 lug pattern tho.

You can always go with a front 14 bolt out of a Ram. They still use the standard lug pattern. Not quite as many locker options, but they still have enough to be viable.

[GWag89]

High steer and soa is a lot of $ and time to invest in a NT d44 imo.

If you are considering a spring flip to gain wheel base and improve approach angle I will recommend dealing with the rear axle first. Move the rear axle back to help Departure angle. The rear overhang is the real hang up on these rigs, the front approach angle is actually pretty good once you get some lift. This way you avoid steering issues

[surfwagoneer]

on another note... I recently built a '78 D44 HP 8 lug with flat tops, high steer, brakes, locker, new bearings, 5.38 gears, etc. By the time I was done, I feel silly cause I now have a ton of $$$ tied up into that little D44.

I'm starting to eyeball the Ford D60 front axles from the '99 and up super dutys in the junkyard and feel that the next time I build axles, it will be with those ford D60's. I wish they had the normal 8 lug pattern tho.

I'm kind of in a similar state. I would eventually like to get my hands on a set of CUCV axles- 60 front and 14 bolt rear, 4.56 and rear detroit. Lock the front and I'll be very capable. I really don't want to waste much or any money on my 44's but have a line on a possible 44HD, 14 bolt set up that has a pass flat top knuckle already on it. I just so happen to have a high steer arm laying around. They have open carriers and 4.10 but are only $250 for the pair. I would still plan on swapping out for CUCV axles when money allowed (still cheaper than building a set up like this) but this set up would make it easy to go spring over plus the benefit of a full float rear. Would be keeping the same gear ratio that I currently have. I spent $350 alone for my 44HD on my wagon and then a ton on flat top knuckles.

[surfwagoneer]

High steer and soa is a lot of $ and time to invest in a NT d44 imo.

If you are considering a spring flip to gain wheel base and improve approach angle I will recommend dealing with the rear axle first. Move the rear axle back to help Departure angle. The rear overhang is the real hang up on these rigs, the front approach angle is actually pretty good once you get some lift. This way you avoid steering issues

The rear is going to get chevy springs, using stock front mount, and a shackle flip. I'm ready to cut!

[GWag89]

Chevy Springs were going to be my next suggestion

[AwesomeJ10]

once u move the rear back and cut, then there is gonna be a big hole in which you need to fill with big tires!

[surfwagoneer]

once u move the rear back and cut, then there is gonna be a big hole in which you need to fill with big tires!

Yes there is! short term plan is to use current set up and run 35-37's. And I already plan on rebuilding the inner wheel. Eventual dream is to run CUCV axles, either keep the th400 or swap to NV4500, Atlas 4 spd (3.8) and 41.5 PBR's. Yes I know very similar to yours Blake, but your Honcho is sick. The 4 spd Atlas will give me a great crawl ratio while keeping good road drivability with the CUCV 4.56. Swapping in the NV4500 would give me a stupid good crawl ratio plus the ability to cruise 85 mph no problem Plus I love driving a standard, especially in an old truck. Dreams are dreams though so we'll see were this thing takes me. Reality is money is always a factor so in the short term we'll see how capable I can get it while getting it on the road asap

[GWag89]

What is your current suspension set up?

[surfwagoneer]

What is your current suspension set up?

Thats actually still to be determined. I highly doubt SOA due to funds right now. So next would be front 3.5" AALs on stock springs, chevy shackle and then chevy springs in the rear utilizing the stock front mount and a shackle flip/shackle to match front height.

(current is ALL STOCK)