81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

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ross80truck
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81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Wed Jul 29, 2015 3:34 pm

First off, I know this is not an FSJ, but all my friends are here and I do not want to start a build thread on another forum. So, here I am! Several years ago I started building an 85 Wagoneer with a 6BT Cummins. In the middle of that build, I bought a 78 Cherokee Chief, AKA Not so Cheap Chief. I bought it as a toy to drive as I was finishing up my Wagoneer. One thing led to another and I never got back to working on my Wagoneer because I was always working on the Chief. Deep down inside I always wanted a Scrambler, so with the wife's permissions and stipulations I bought an 81 Scrambler. The goal was to sell the Chief and drive the scrambler as I finished the Wagoneer. Well, when I went and looked at the Scrambler it was a cold, rainy day and I did not drive it very far or very fast. It had a great almost rust free body. So, I bought it. Well, after the rain stopped and the weather warmed up I quickly found at that this "driver" was not a driver. So, I sold the Chief, but I am still not working on the Wagoneer yet because once again I am putting another project in front of it. I need my hand slapped I think. So, here is a build thread for the present project standing in my way of me finishing up my Diesel Wagoneer.

Here is a pic of it the day I bought it in the rain in College Station, TX. I was very excited, I have always wanted a Scrambler.
Image

Here is a pic of it parked next to the Chief before I sold the Chief.
Image

When the sun finally came out and the weather warmed and I started driving it, is when I realized this thing needed a lot of help. This is the best this thing would flex when I got it.
Image
Last edited by ross80truck on Wed Jul 29, 2015 3:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Wed Jul 29, 2015 3:44 pm

When I bought the CJ8, it came with an AMC 360, TF799, and a Dana 300. It had not originally come with a V8, the previous owner had swapped it it. The motor ran strong too. The previous owner had also done a SOA conversion and I was told they were wagoneer axles. They were not though, they were out of a Scout. I should have realized that, but as I stated before, it was wet and cold and I was more concerned about rust than axles. And if you do not know this, Scout parts are expensive! It is a Dana 44 front and rear though. Tires were basically brand new BFG KM2s and were 35-12.50R17 on I believe they call them crusher rims. All four corners had dual shocks and wore out bushings. Brakes worked, sort of.

All I can say is that the church parking lot I test drove this thing in must have been the smoothest piece of asphalt ever, because after getting it on the road it was a different story. The thing road like a wagon and the turning radius was horrible. My Ford Dually, 4 door long bed 4x4 turned sharper than this thing.

After the first week of driving it I started making a list of necessary repair because I was not comfortable with my family riding in it with me. One thing lead to another as it usually does and now I am further away from getting my Wagoneer finished than I was before. But hey, the body of this thing is in great shape.
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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ross80truck
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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:10 am

Some of you that have followed my Cheap Chief build thread might remember the 401 that was in it. I had spent some time and money on that motor and I really did not want to part with it. So, before I sold the Chief, I yanked the 360 out of the Scrambler and put it in the Chief and kept the 401. I had also previously bought an NV4500 that I was going to put in the Chief, but when the decision was made to sell it, I kept that as well. So, my drivetrain will be an AMC 401, NV4500 and then I will retain the Dana 300.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:39 am

Here is how it innocently started. We went ahead and pulled everything off the front. It was much easier to get to the motor and the suspension work I was going to do. I had originally planned on running Wagoneer springs up front that I had from my Diesel Wagoneer. So, we were going to need to cut all the brackets off the frame in order to mount the new wider and longer springs. Pulling all the sheet metal off the front just gave us more room to work.

Image

Here is a zoomed in picture of the tie rod. If you look closely right under the license plate you will see that instead of converting to high steer when they did the SOA conversion, they simple cut the tie rod and welded in this plate to drop the tie rod under the spring. I will not get into the discussion of if this is a good idea or not, but it is what was causing my steering issues. This plate would hit the spring restricting my turning radius. So, this needs to be addressed. The problem though, is again, these are Scout axles and Scout parts are expensive. The cheapest high steer setup I could find was like $1200.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

twisted frame
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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby twisted frame » Thu Jul 30, 2015 7:50 pm

Call me Capt. Obvious but nice going keeping the 401! :-bd

Would it be easier and possibly less expensive to find a Waggy D44 front so you can go high-steer for less?
73 J4000. 360, MC 2100, T18A, D20, stock closed knuckle Dana 44 front, 60-2 rear. Warn Lock-O-Matics, Warn/Belleview electric winch, true duals with glasspacks, old-school front diff skid plate, used 265 Toyos on 16" AR wheels.

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Fri Jul 31, 2015 7:37 am

twisted frame wrote:Call me Capt. Obvious but nice going keeping the 401! :-bd

Would it be easier and possibly less expensive to find a Waggy D44 front so you can go high-steer for less?


I thought of that, but that would mean I would have to change the bolt pattern on the front from 5 lug to six. Then I would have to do something to the rear to make it match, then I would have to find another set of 17" rims to mount the tires on that are brand new. I have a call in on a set of one tons, but that will mean a rim change as well. But they are out of a CUCV which means they will have 4:56 gears and a locker in the back already. This may be the cheaper way to go since the Scout axles appear to only have a 3:73 gears in them with no locker. This makes it under geared for the 35" tires.
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby Blake » Fri Jul 31, 2015 8:30 am

nice looking rig!

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ross80truck
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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Wed Aug 05, 2015 8:16 am

Just made a deal on a set of one tons out of a CUCV. Headed to pick them up this afternoon!
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby csuengr » Wed Aug 05, 2015 9:20 am

Ah, the good old days when you could sell a Scout front axle for $1000.
1977 Cherokee S, Ford 5.0, 5 speed, BW 1356, 33 x 10.50 BFG's. My DD and only vehicle.

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:49 am

csuengr wrote:Ah, the good old days when you could sell a Scout front axle for $1000.


Wow, $1000, that would be awesome! I am just trying to get a $200 for it and am not having much luck.
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Thu Aug 06, 2015 6:51 am

Picked these up yesterday. One Dana 60 and two Corp 14 bolts. One of the 14 bolts is out of a Dually, so it is narrower than a standard width. The other Corp 14 is standard width, but is missing the ring gear, carrier and locker. So, out of the two I can make one good complete rear axle.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:25 am

I also decided to run 63" suburban springs in the rear. They give a nice ride and flex like crazy. We started looking at cutting all the spring brackets off in the rear and then decided that there were only 8 body mount bolts standing between us and the dropping the whole frame off the body. So, we did the only logical thing and took separated the body from the frame. This now gives me easy access to everything I need in order to cut and weld on new suspension mounts. Plus I can clean the frame and POR15 it while I have it all apart.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby Gumby » Fri Aug 07, 2015 6:38 am

Man you are just bustin it out! I should just bring my project over and let you go to work 8-) :-bd
1984 GW 360/727/208.... 4"/ 31"
2004 CRD QC SRW 3500 4X4 (DD)
1983 "project Dubya" (long term)

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Fri Aug 07, 2015 8:08 am

Gumby wrote:Man you are just bustin it out! I should just bring my project over and let you go to work 8-) :-bd


This is the easy stuff. It is all the detail that goes into setting up the suspension and cleaning the frame and painting that will take a long time. It also helps that my shop is a little slow right now and when someone runs our of stuff to do, I have them go wrench on the jeep for a little while until I get them lined out on the next task.
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Mon Aug 17, 2015 7:53 am

Here is where we sit now. We have totally pulled the body off the frame and put it on a rotisserie. This will give us easy access to a few places that we wanted to fix. Plus I plan on painting POR15 on the under body and inside the tub. I really do not want to repaint, but I might since I am this far in.

Image

We have now stripped the frame of everything. Any and all suspension mounting points have been cut off and ground smooth. The body bushings were shot, and rusted the body mounts on the frame. So, we have a little work to do there. But with the frame like this, it will be easy to work on and repair. My long term goal is to 3 link the front with coil overs. I am wondering if since I have this thing so far apart if I should just not go ahead and do it now. It would be easier. Here is a pic of the frame now. Also, if you look really close at the storage unit that is open in the back of the picture, you will see my diesel wagoneer that needs to be finished.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby Atla » Thu Aug 27, 2015 3:11 pm

I love Scramblers!
~Atla. (I'm just here for the pictures)
1983 J-10
2001 TJ

My Build Thread - viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2722

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby SJTD » Fri Aug 28, 2015 6:49 am

Yeah, Scramblers can look pretty good if you shorten the wheelbase and bob the tail so they look like a CJ-7. :lol: :lol: :lol:
Sic friatur crustulum

'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Thu Sep 17, 2015 10:08 am

I started rebuilding the transfer case. I am going to be running a Dana 300. I am adding a twin stick kit, a AA heavy duty output shaft and an AA new input shaft to mate it to an NV4500. When I tore the transfer case apart I found one of the bearings had spun on the input shaft. Not a big deal since I was putting in a new input shaft, just made taking it apart a pain.

Image

I am also adding a Part's Mike e-brake on the transfer case. I was thinking of adding a Tera-Low kit, but I am going to wait and wheel it first and see how I like it the way it is.

Image

Here is the 401 bolted to the NV4500 and the Dana 300. I also added a serpentine belt kit to the engine while I had it sitting on the engine stand. Was not real happy with the serpentine belt kit. I had to do a lot of shimming and modifications to make it all line up, and I am still not certain it is correct. I will have to get it all running first to see if I have it set up right.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Wed Jan 06, 2016 3:40 pm

It has been a few months since I have updated this. Work has still been getting done on the jeep, I just have not had the time to update it. Hopefully I can get this thread caught up to its current state.

I do not have a good picture of it, but if you look closely, we also added a serpentine belt kit on the front of the 401.

Once the engine, transmission and transfer case were all assembled we set the assembly back in the frame. We needed to build a custom cross member since everything moved.

Image

After we got everything poisoned how we wanted it and the angle angle set, we build a crossmember. You can see it laying on the floor next to the frame. Because I like to overkill things and it was also easier. We set the frame on the ground next to my 6' radial arm drill press and then used the drill press to drill holes in the frame where we wanted to mount our transfer case. Then we inserted a threaded bung into each hole and welded it in. Now if I ever have one of these strip the threads out, it will be very easy to grind the weld off, pull the old bung out and weld a new one in.

Image

Here is the new cross member bolted to the frame.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301

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Re: 81 Scrambler Build - I know its not an FSJ

Postby ross80truck » Wed Jan 06, 2016 3:56 pm

Now that the motor is mounted where I wanted it, we went ahead and roughly bolted the body back in place. We also rolled some axles under it to begin to see what we are going to have to do with the suspension. I really like this look, but that is just me.

Image

My plan is to run Bushwacker style fender flares, so we also went ahead and mounted these since I knew this would be something we would have to consider as build the suspension.

Image
Priorities
1. God
2. Wife ( Sarah )
3. Children ( Lane & Dirk )
4. Work
5. Jeep

Man it is hard to keep them in the right order!

85 Wagoneer, 6bt, NV4500, Black Box, NP205, D60 front, Corp 14 rear http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=1446
76 Cherokee Chief - Cheap Build - SOLD http://fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=2605
81 Jeep Scrambler viewtopic.php?f=12&t=8769&p=97301#p97301


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