1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

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Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Ok. Been doing some digging and found an fsm regarding ip starvation due to supply pressure bypassing fuel regulator return valve.
It's a spring loaded ball type valve, over time spring compresses allowing too much fuel to return to tank.
Diagnostic procedure. Pull the valve, check spring length, if not 26-27mm give it a stretch and slap it back in.

I'll have to give this a try first.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

All right, no progress yet..
But in order to switch rear.axle i need a rear mounted tank. So I'm thinking of using a 57 bel air 16 gallon. My exhaust is full length inside the frame which takes up some room and that tank should fit well. Going to be ordering soon.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Well after a long debate I've managed to replace my injectors, haven't driven it yet but even after the first startup I have noticed the engine sounds much healthier. Despite the fact that I had lost prime of the fuel system to change the injectors it started up almost immediately after just a bit of cranking. With the old injectors it took quite a bit of cranking as well just to start the motor and that's with the fuel system Primed, so needless to say I'm optimistic hoping to take it for a drive up the hill tonight and see how it does.
fingers crossed...
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear
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tedlovesjeeps71
Posts: 2905
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2016 4:39 pm

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by tedlovesjeeps71 »

I wonder how much gunk and build up you could remove if you did a full cycle of biodiesel. Probably make that engine like a spring chicken.

Red-dog
Posts: 70
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2016 12:06 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by Red-dog »

How did it go last night?
'86 GW, work in progress.
'01 wj, DD

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Sorry,
Been a bit.
She was improved, but still lacking.

So there was 3 fairy different things happening on this last run.

On previous attempts it either heated up, which was fixed or was just plain gutless.
Of all previous attempts I had a running start at it and it made no difference or not if I downshifted it just didn't want to go.

And of all other previous attempts it was fairly hot outside, this time however it was night time and reasonably cold below 60 degrees as well I had different injectors and there was a wreck at the railroad tracks at the bottom of the hill so I had to start the Hill from at about 25 miles an hour.

Noticeable difference this last time was I was definitely able 2 feel a throttle response and as well I did make it up the hill but it started to poop out towards the crest.

So now I'm thinking I might need to improve upon the air intake temperature and possibly even charge air temperature so that's what I'll start fooling with next Bud right now I'm going to rebuild the Scout rear end got it on the table now.

I really need to be very sure that my rear brakes are dialed in before I get this thing to perform any better I have absolutely no idea what's going on behind those rear drums the only thing I've done to them is bleeding to improve to pedal.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Sorry,
Been a bit.
She was improved, but still lacking.

So there was 3 fairy different things happening on this last run.

On previous attempts it either heated up, which was fixed or was just plain gutless.
Of all previous attempts I had a running start at it and it made no difference or not if I downshifted it just didn't want to go.

And of all other previous attempts it was fairly hot outside, this time however it was night time and reasonably cold below 60 degrees as well I had different injectors and there was a wreck at the railroad tracks at the bottom of the hill so I had to start the Hill from at about 25 miles an hour.

Noticeable difference this last time was I was definitely able 2 feel a throttle response and as well I did make it up the hill but it started to poop out towards the crest.

So now I'm thinking I might need to improve upon the air intake temperature and possibly even charge air temperature so that's what I'll start fooling with next Bud right now I'm going to rebuild the Scout rear end got it on the table now.

I really need to be very sure that my rear brakes are dialed in before I get this thing to perform any better I have absolutely no idea what's going on behind those rear drums the only thing I've done to them is bleeding to improve to pedal.
20181104_112754.jpg
Image
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1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

Nikkormat
Posts: 3623
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 11:45 pm
Location: Salt Lake City

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by Nikkormat »

How do your gear ratios/final drive speeds compare with a stock 300d? I've been researching for a OM606 conversion and it seems these mercedes's like to be geared deep.
Gabe, "reformed" Jeep hoarder.
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tedlovesjeeps71
Posts: 2905
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2016 4:39 pm

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by tedlovesjeeps71 »

Nikkormat wrote:How do your gear ratios/final drive speeds compare with a stock 300d? I've been researching for a OM606 conversion and it seems these mercedes's like to be geared deep.
Like 2:72 deep? Image

Nikkormat
Posts: 3623
Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2014 11:45 pm
Location: Salt Lake City

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by Nikkormat »

Tall? Wide? Short? Long? Too many terms! Like high number numerically.
Gabe, "reformed" Jeep hoarder.
User avatar

tedlovesjeeps71
Posts: 2905
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2016 4:39 pm

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by tedlovesjeeps71 »

tedlovesjeeps71 wrote:
Nikkormat wrote:How do your gear ratios/final drive speeds compare with a stock 300d? I've been researching for a OM606 conversion and it seems these mercedes's like to be geared deep.
Like 2:72 deep? Image

Nope...but almost as bad!
Image

2:82? Image

Red-dog
Posts: 70
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2016 12:06 pm
Location: Charleston, SC

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by Red-dog »

I think they put such tall gears in the Benz cars because the had small tire diameters and people wanted to drive them at 90mph down the Autobahn. Neither applies to my FSJ and I dont think it applies to 230ohc's vehicle either. Lots of final drive calculators online (Grimm Jeeper is my favorite) and I bet finding the sweet spot in an om617 torque band cant be too hard. Does this sound snarky? Honestly not meant to. I have the flu. My point is I dont think MB gear ratios are necessarily relevant. Apples to oranges comparison.
'86 GW, work in progress.
'01 wj, DD

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Yes I think gearing may have something to do with the problems I'm having at first I thought I didn't have enough gearing as in I wasn't low geared enough but I'm led to believe that my gearing it may actually be too low (3.73) in comparison to the Mercedes which was around the 2.72 rear end gearing compared with the stock mercedes 25 inch diameter tires which gives you a final drive ratio of 7.8 I believe now where this comes into effect with being too low geared is the injection pump governor. Where the governor will cut fuel at high RPM.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

rocklaurence
Vendor
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Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by rocklaurence »

I would think for performance you want the engine at 2500 rpm at 60mph. Wont those little engines rev to 5000?

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Ahhlrighty,
Image
Ordered a gas tank to mount in the rear, it's a 57 bel air reproduction.
Kinda small but it should fit, it's 16 gallons which is the most I could ever get in that coffin tank so no big loss.
20190106_125837.jpg
I've got the Scout axle mostly put together having some trouble getting the wheel bearings off shafts so I'm trying to make it tool to make it a little bit easier might take a bit of time specially since I've got no idea what I'm doing setting this thing up so just taking it slow hopefully it'll work out.

What kind of pinion angle should I shoot for when I weld the perches on? I'm still planning on flipping the rear shackles. Do I need to rotate the frame mounts to do that?
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Last edited by 230ohc on Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:35 pm, edited 2 times in total.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

rocklaurence wrote:I would think for performance you want the engine at 2500 rpm at 60mph. Wont those little engines rev to 5000?

Yes they are a little more tolerant to slightly higher revs than most older diesels, from what I understand but I clearly don't know much. And this being my first diesel I've still got a lot to learn.
I need to install more monitoring equipment other than temp, boost and oil pressure. Like egt and tach mostly as well iat ant oil temp. I think I'll try to get the tach sorted first. I've got one it's a vdo and the motor has a vdo driver but the tach doesn't have a 5 cyl option so still trying to work that out.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

SJTD
Posts: 1923
Joined: Tue May 21, 2013 12:02 pm
Location: Lompoc, Sunland or somewhere between

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by SJTD »

If you're using u-joints on both ends of the drive shaft the pinion shaft should be parallel to the transmission shaft. If the trans points down 5 degrees the pinion should point up 5 degrees.

If you don't have the rear crossmember mounted yet you can play with its position somewhat to minimize u-joint angles. I say somewhat under the assumption that the fronts are done and you don't want to stress them too much.

If you have a CV joint on the trans the pinion should point upward so the driveshaft is parallel to the pinion shaft.

You don't want to weld the spring mounts on the axle until you have the frame mounts finalized. I'm sure you're on top of this but I though I'd mention it.
Sic friatur crustulum

'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Thanks sjtd. No cv in the rear, just 2 u joints(one at each end) so equal angle to output it will have to be.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

So I made a tool to get the wheel bearings off the axle shafts, worked Allright but I think I sacrificed the half inch fine thread shaft from my small puller, see if it makes it after the second shaft
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear

Topic author
230ohc
Posts: 430
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 2:27 am
Location: Northern California

Re: 1964 wagoneer... om617 diesel

Post by 230ohc »

Almost got the rear end done, pinion pleload was fun...
just need to install pinion seal and retorque everything, set pinion angle and give it a coat of paint.
then the fuel tank relocated.
20190106_125648.jpg
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Last edited by 230ohc on Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:37 pm, edited 2 times in total.
1964 willys wagoneer
Om617 turbo diesel
Ax15
Dana 300
3.73 dana 27 front
3.73 dana 44 rear
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