Brutus 2.0

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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:14 pm

Not a lot of progress but taking bites of the elephant!

Motor mounts are welded... just need to be cleaned up. Started the valve spacers... half done. Cylinders are joined together... coupling nuts, drilled and pressed with roll pins.

Image

Cylinder lengths are looking really good!

Image
Last edited by BRUTUS on Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
'74 J30 with some upgrades

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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Tue Jan 24, 2017 3:54 pm

Progress is progress... York compressor mount came in the mail from CU Offroad. I am not very impressed but it will work. 6-groove pulley and clutch/electromagnet installed with new belt (glad I didn't buy a replacement stock belt!)

Yes I realize that it will be difficult to access the power steering pump fill port but it is NOT impossible!

Image

Finished up the valve bank spacers.

Image
Last edited by BRUTUS on Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
'74 J30 with some upgrades

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shimniok
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby shimniok » Tue Jan 24, 2017 8:40 pm

Just tuning in. Haven't read everything. Do you need an amp? I have one I doubt I will get around to using.

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'86 GW "Troubled Child" tc.wagoneer.org
360, TBI, 4" Skyjacker, 33" BFG MTs, WT D44+ARB, WT AMC20 + LockRight, CB 2m 6m 70cm, K0FSJ
The world's first Robotic Full Size Jeep!

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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:17 am

shimniok wrote:Just tuning in. Haven't read everything. Do you need an amp? I have one I doubt I will get around to using.


Thanks for the offer but I have had one specifically for this for a long time and just never installed it... you know how it is! :mrgreen:
'74 J30 with some upgrades

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Knucklehead
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby Knucklehead » Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:29 am

In your first picture, the thing that would concern me the most is the amount of contact the alternator has with the belt.

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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Wed Jan 25, 2017 3:54 pm

Knucklehead wrote:In your first picture, the thing that would concern me the most is the amount of contact the alternator has with the belt.


I was a little concerned about that too. I have some pictures that CU Offroad sent me of the whole thing in operation and they don't have any issues.

I have an idler pulley that I could mount in between the alternator and the compressor if absolutely needed.

Time will tell.
'74 J30 with some upgrades

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Knucklehead
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby Knucklehead » Wed Jan 25, 2017 4:30 pm

I would think that belt tension will be critical. Banjo String tight is the term i think i am looking for. :D

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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby Adventure_Wagon88 » Thu Jan 26, 2017 7:44 pm

I would definitely be concerned about the alternator/belt contact. On my of my XJs in the past I had done a different belt setup, I think it was because I changed power steering pumps, but I don't exactly recall, and the way it wraps the alternator in you setup picture it looks way too familiar! It was fine until there was any excess draw on the electrial like a slightly weakened battery, electric fan, or running headlights and hella lights. I didn't really ever hear it slipping, but I noticed a buildup of rubber near the alt after a few weeks and knew I was going to wear the belt very prematurely. You could give it a shot, but if it's possible to return the belt and run the extra idler setup with a longer belt that is absolutely the way I'd go.

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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Fri Jan 27, 2017 10:11 am

I appreciate the concern but it may turn out to not be a problem at all. The tensioner keeps the belt very tight.

Here is the picture they sent me (since the entire kit did not come with directions... these were my directions) of this setup running on their 5.3.

Image

My inclination is to think that if it is running on this rig and everything is kosher that most likely it will run on mine as well with the same setup. I will most likely make a bracket for the idler quick and have it ready as a backup but I don't want to make a problem out of something that isn't. I have enough of those already!
Last edited by BRUTUS on Wed Mar 21, 2018 12:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
'74 J30 with some upgrades

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shimniok
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby shimniok » Fri Jan 27, 2017 11:45 am

I can relate. :) It's easy enough to fix if it turns out that it truly needs fixing.

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'86 GW "Troubled Child" tc.wagoneer.org
360, TBI, 4" Skyjacker, 33" BFG MTs, WT D44+ARB, WT AMC20 + LockRight, CB 2m 6m 70cm, K0FSJ
The world's first Robotic Full Size Jeep!

letank
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby letank » Fri Jan 27, 2017 8:02 pm

Great, you can use a power steering with a remote reservoir, came on XJ or YJ around 98

check this

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f12/how- ... ng-555727/
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:30 pm

letank wrote:Great, you can use a power steering with a remote reservoir, came on XJ or YJ around 98


Thanks Michel! I will definately look into doing that!

Well, being that my design philosophy is "build it 150%" I took the advice and made a pulley bracket and got another serpentine belt today!

Image

Bracket... 1/4 base, 1/2" machined standoff

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The back of the idler pulley... to show the "step"

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Pretty good alignment if I do say so myself!

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So the belt I got at Vatozone is actually longer than their "belt measuring" tool! So on a leap of faith, and a receipt for return if necessary, I got it and it worked! Plan is to keep the original belt and the CU Offroad belts as trail spares just in case.
'74 J30 with some upgrades

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Nikkormat
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby Nikkormat » Sat Jan 28, 2017 7:46 pm

That serpentine wrap looks way better! I can't wait to see it done.
Now this ol' Jeep needs a coat a' paint
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby Adventure_Wagon88 » Sun Jan 29, 2017 9:10 am

Beautiful, that setup will definitely not give you any trouble gripping the alternator or compressor. Looks to me you've doubled the surface area contact on the alt and have about 30-40% more contact on the compressor as well. That can't be a bad thing! I'm sure the spare belt will easily serve the purpose in a pinch should you need it, good to keep that one around too. Nice work!

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Knucklehead
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby Knucklehead » Sun Jan 29, 2017 12:57 pm

I am thinking you will be very glad you added the extra idler. The belt contact with the alternator looks much better.

letank
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby letank » Sun Jan 29, 2017 1:20 pm

check with Elliot, he sells a add-on PS bracket for dual PS pump, the pict has a PS pump without reservoir, on ebay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/AMC-Jeep-V8-Dua ... 7675.l2557

and in IFSJA site his vendor page for the hydroboost

http://www.ifsja.org/forums/vb/showthread.php?t=106056

found this reservoir, on another Elliot post

http://www.txfsja.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=171

Image

Yes, I am trolling the web for an easier servicable power steering pump
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work

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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Sat Feb 04, 2017 10:39 pm

Today I pulled the 203/205 combo to get into the tailhousing of the 4500 and see why reverse and overdrive did not work. Turns out the shift rail was just gummed up. A couple pry jobs and removing some gunk freed it right up. WHEW! My imagination thought it was gonna be way worse! That was when I noticed that there was a lot of slack in the main shaft gear... around 3/4" movement.
This is where it is supposed to ride:
Image

This is where it should not ever be:
Image

Sooooooo, I need the "4500 tailshaft fix!" Will order that today but I just have to say, "how the hell did a simple spanner nut on an output shaft EVER pass engineering, quality control, etc without anyone flagging it at a huge transmission manufacturer?!?!?" No roll pin, no set screw, no press fit, no cotter pin, no lockwasher (they actually COULD have put a giant wave or lockwasher behind the spanner nut and been at least 80% more effective than what they delivered to market!). As a design engineer, I cannot believe it!

I also purchased a factory block heater chord from the Chevy dealer. I was a little surprised at the price tag so I'm going to see if Autozone's heater will work.
Last edited by BRUTUS on Wed Mar 21, 2018 1:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
'74 J30 with some upgrades

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tedlovesjeeps71
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby tedlovesjeeps71 » Sat Feb 04, 2017 11:12 pm

My dodge lost 5th gear and when I learned why it was a real wtf moment.
You'll have to check yours to make sure it didn't "hourglass" the gear/shaft. Which fix design you going with?


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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby SJTD » Sun Feb 05, 2017 9:02 am

Anyone have a link for info on this? I've got a NV4500 in the Wag with a Dana 300. Haven't put oil in it yet so if I need to fix something now's the time. As I recall that nut took 400ish ft-lb. Had to make a big spanner adapter for my torque wrench.

Also have a Diesel truck with 200k and no problems yet.
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'84 GW with Nissan SD33T, early Chev NV4500, 300, narrowed Ford reverse 44, narrowed Ford 60, SOA/reversed shackle in fornt, lowered mount/flipped shackle in rear.

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BRUTUS
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Re: Brutus 2.0

Postby BRUTUS » Sun Feb 05, 2017 10:25 am

tedlovesjeeps71 wrote:My dodge lost 5th gear and when I learned why it was a real wtf moment.
You'll have to check yours to make sure it didn't "hourglass" the gear/shaft. Which fix design you going with?


Where does the shaft hourglass? I guess I can imagine the gear teeth hourglassing. Everything looked really clean in there and the teeth look really good. This is probably why I picked this tranny up for only $300... one of the spanner slots is really mushroomed so I figure the previous owner must have tried to retighten it with a chisel or something and decided to cut his losses the second time around.

This is the only fix I have found so far for a 32-spline Chevy.
https://www.amazon.com/NV27134M-NV4500-Transmission-Dated-Gear/dp/B00P8EECKW/ref=sr_1_1?s=automotive&ie=UTF8&qid=1486313404&sr=1-1&keywords=nv4500+5th+gear+nut+Chevy

There seem to be hundreds of fixes for 27-spline Dodge NV's.

My other thought is to machine a donut that is a light press fit over the splines, takes up the "space" between the spanner and the 203 input. The press fit would keep the donut from free spinning so everything would turn together, output shaft, spanner, donut and 203 input. With the cost of these kits, this might just be the way I will go.

SJTD wrote:Anyone have a link for info on this? I've got a NV4500 in the Wag with a Dana 300. Haven't put oil in it yet so if I need to fix something now's the time. As I recall that nut took 400ish ft-lb. Had to make a big spanner adapter for my torque wrench.

Also have a Diesel truck with 200k and no problems yet.


Did you get that torque spec out of a rebuild manual or something? Did you use a torque multiplier or do you weigh 400lb-ish? :mrgreen:

I still wouldn't trust that the torque on the nut would keep everything kosher through it's useful life. Obviously, if there is this much of a problem with these trannys AFTER they were factory spec'd and released, I wouldn't trust their specs any further than I could throw them. The good news is that you don't necessarily need to take the tailhousing off to put a "fix" on, just the transfer case. Google/YouTube will turn up tons of info on the fixes.
'74 J30 with some upgrades


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