Trying to figure out TRANS/TRANSFER-CASE

[pratty85]

Hello all, I bought a new DD today, its a 1983 Cherokee Chief, runs and drives with a 190k miles, and has tiny amounts of corrosion. It has an AMC 360 V8 (all orignal) with a 4 speed manual. I thought it might have a T18 in it, but I crawled under it and saw that the transmission was painted originally green? I got all the numbers I could see off it, and I also noticed it has a New Process transfer case.




Trans #'s C-2604203(casting#) and the tag had TTCC 29, 5352086 It looks like a top loader....NOTE(1st gear is not a granny gear)

Transfer case #C-13685(casting#) 80

I was wondering if someone could help me find out what trans/transfer-case combo is in this thing and if it is original?

[Stuka]

From the factory an 80+ Cherokee/Wagoneer/J10 with a manual will have a T176 transmission and an NP208 t-case. The trans is a medium duty all aluminum close ratio transmission. Only real known issue is popping out of second when engine braking (synchro wears fast on second for whatever reason) and the shifter itself wears fast to where it will shift past 1st and 3rd when it gets bad.

The t-case is a very durable unit that has no common issues outside of normal wear. Chain can stretch and bearings can wear. Be sure yours has ATF in it, they came with motor oil from the factory that caused them to wear too fast. It was later changed to ATF.

[fulsizjeep]

Good looking Cherokee, congrats! I have never seen that style AC unit under the dash. It must have come sans AC from the factory.

[pratty85]

From the factory an 80+ Cherokee/Wagoneer/J10 with a manual will have a T176 transmission and an NP208 t-case. The trans is a medium duty all aluminum close ratio transmission. Only real known issue is popping out of second when engine braking (synchro wears fast on second for whatever reason) and the shifter itself wears fast to where it will shift past 1st and 3rd when it gets bad.

The t-case is a very durable unit that has no common issues outside of normal wear. Chain can stretch and bearings can wear. Be sure yours has ATF in it, they came with motor oil from the factory that caused them to wear too fast. It was later changed to ATF.

Thanks for the info! The trans doesn't look aluminum but I will take a closer look tomorrow, I also noticed that there is, what appears to be an adapter between the bell housing and transmission, approx 3.5". Any Idea what that is? I can take a picture.

The transmission shifts great and is very tight! I am happy with it so far!

[pratty85]

Good looking Cherokee, congrats! I have never seen that style AC unit under the dash. It must have come sans AC from the factory.

Thanks! I will look at it tomorrow and see what brand it is, its nice and tucked up compared to others I have seen, and it blows cold!!

[Tin Medic]

That looks like a T176 shifter.

[derf]

From the factory an 80+ Cherokee/Wagoneer/J10 with a manual will have a T176 transmission and an NP208 t-case. The trans is a medium duty all aluminum close ratio transmission. Only real known issue is popping out of second when engine braking (synchro wears fast on second for whatever reason) and the shifter itself wears fast to where it will shift past 1st and 3rd when it gets bad.

The t-case is a very durable unit that has no common issues outside of normal wear. Chain can stretch and bearings can wear. Be sure yours has ATF in it, they came with motor oil from the factory that caused them to wear too fast. It was later changed to ATF.

Thanks for the info! The trans doesn't look aluminum but I will take a closer look tomorrow, I also noticed that there is, what appears to be an adapter between the bell housing and transmission, approx 3.5". Any Idea what that is? I can take a picture.

The transmission shifts great and is very tight! I am happy with it so far!

If I recall correctly, Jeep put an adapter between the V8 and the transmission so that it would end up in the same place as it would if it was behind a straight 6.

[Stuka]

From the factory an 80+ Cherokee/Wagoneer/J10 with a manual will have a T176 transmission and an NP208 t-case. The trans is a medium duty all aluminum close ratio transmission. Only real known issue is popping out of second when engine braking (synchro wears fast on second for whatever reason) and the shifter itself wears fast to where it will shift past 1st and 3rd when it gets bad.

The t-case is a very durable unit that has no common issues outside of normal wear. Chain can stretch and bearings can wear. Be sure yours has ATF in it, they came with motor oil from the factory that caused them to wear too fast. It was later changed to ATF.

Thanks for the info! The trans doesn't look aluminum but I will take a closer look tomorrow, I also noticed that there is, what appears to be an adapter between the bell housing and transmission, approx 3.5". Any Idea what that is? I can take a picture.

The transmission shifts great and is very tight! I am happy with it so far!

If I recall correctly, Jeep put an adapter between the V8 and the transmission so that it would end up in the same place as it would if it was behind a straight 6.

Yup, this was true for any of the manuals behind V8's. There was a spacer behind the i6 when used with a T15/T18a, but it was very short. With the T176 there is no spacer between the bell and trans.

[pratty85]

Mine definitely has a spacer....

[pratty85]

So what do I have?

[jeep ranch]

So what do I have?

looks like the factory configuration from that pic

[Stuka]

So what do I have?

Looks like a T176 with the factory spacer that is used with V8's. Manuals in 80+ rigs only used an NP208 for the t-case, so thats a given.

[pratty85]

Thanks! I appreciate the help! Second question, does anyone think this would be a decent transmission to run with a 4bt or not? Of course using appropriate bell housing, clutch, etc....All I will be doing is some mild offroading now and then and using it as a DD. I have a local contact that just got in 20 4bts....

[Stuka]

The V8 version would not be ideal due to the longer input shaft. It will push the transmission back quite a bit compared to the i6 version.

I think it would hold up ok. They are not known to be super strong, but they are not prone to breaking either. But it should be somewhat easy to find a bell to work with it.

Although if it was me, I would want to find an overdrive transmission for a diesel, since they are very RPM limited. An NV4500 would be awesome, but not cheap either.

[derf]

It may work, if you can find the right bell housing to go with it.

But if I was doing the swap I'd look for a 12v Cummins Ram truck in the bone yard and grab the NV4500 with the 241DHD or NP271 that's behind it. I don't know if the bellhousing is compatible between the 6BT and the 4BT but on the off chance it isn't you can find one that will work.

If I swap a 4BT into Truck Norris that's what I plan on doing.

[pratty85]

I am going to do some measuring as soon as this rain goes away. I would like to run a NV4500 so I would have an additional gear. But I am going to be putting a 6" with 35's on this rig. There isn't a tag on the axle so I am not sure what my gear ratio is, but if I go to a 35" tall tire will it help me with an rpm limited motor? I am guessing I have 3:50's....ish. not certain at all. I do know that 4:10's with a 35" tall tire is the equivalent of having close to 31" tall tires actual.

[derf]

I am going to do some measuring as soon as this rain goes away. I would like to run a NV4500 so I would have an additional gear. But I am going to be putting a 6" with 35's on this rig. There isn't a tag on the axle so I am not sure what my gear ratio is, but if I go to a 35" tall tire will it help me with an rpm limited motor? I am guessing I have 3:50's....ish. not certain at all. I do know that 4:10's with a 35" tall tire is the equivalent of having close to 31" tall tires actual.

There's a really good gear ratio calculator out there that would answer your gearing questions.


But yeah, 4.10 gears with 35's would put you at about 1950 RPM at 65 which is about where you would want to be.

[pratty85]

Would a T18 be a better transmission? I know mine needs some work, so I started looking around and found a T-18 with transfer case out of a 77-78 wagoneer. I thought if I could find something to swap in without much hastle, I could rebuild the trans and T-case I find, and just swap them out, that way I could Upgrade at the same time.

By the way I can't believe this thing doesn't use any oil.....The motor is good enough to get some more life, but all my leaks are in the trans output shaft and the transfer case.

What are the thoughts?

[Stuka]

The transmission would work, but the transfer case will be the wrong drop. 79 and older are passenger drop, 80 and later are driver drop. So you would have to switch front axles. And no your current t-case would not work on a 79 and older T18a without an adapter.

The T18a is a great transmission. And it was offered in 80+ J20's, but its not a very common setup. And would require new front and rear drive shafts.

[pratty85]

Good to know! I have a ton to learn obviously....Bit by bit.