Wiring query

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89er
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Wiring query

Post by 89er »

Diving into my wiring issues today. If this any of these look familiar to anyone I could sure use some help figuring them out.

Coming from firewall beneath vacuum reservoir - 3 wire cluster, zebra, green, blue
Image

Blue wire coming from firewall below heat blower.
Image

Red fat wire
Image

Front passenger floorboard red and black wires
Image

Rear driver side bumper black wire
Image
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan
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tgreese
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Re: Wiring query

Post by tgreese »

Year, model, equipment?

Checked the wiring diagram? http://oljeep.com/gw/elec/GW_wiring.html (or in the TSM for your year)

The stripe on wires is called a "trace" and it can be white or black, generally depending on the base color of the wire. The diagram typically does not call out the stripe color, ie "RED W/TR" could be either color stripe.
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 Chryco Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green
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89er
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Re: Wiring query

Post by 89er »

Sorry. 89 Grand wagoneer, stock as far as I know.
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan
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tgreese
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Re: Wiring query

Post by tgreese »

The '88 diagram on the Tom Collins site will be very close if not the same as '89. The bulkhead connector locations are numbered and will determine the nature of the big red wire. Last pic, possible the original harness had a bad ground and a PO added that wire to supplement the original ground. Trace it and see where it goes. Blue wire looks like it's also a PO (previous owner) addition. Trace also. Visual, multimeter or test light, as needed. Door jam, consult wiring diagram. Top picture, consult diagram ... or hope that someone with your year GW knows what it is from memory and reads your thread.
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 Chryco Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green
Blockchain the vote.

letank
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Re: Wiring query

Post by letank »

89er wrote:Diving into my wiring issues today. If this any of these look familiar to anyone I could sure use some help figuring them out.

Coming from firewall beneath vacuum reservoir - 3 wire cluster, zebra, green, blue
Image
The canister on the air filter housing that we can see on the pict, the one closest to the air filter can, needs to be connected to a vacuum source, otherwise the flapper called the kritter proof flapper will stay close and the engine will run poorly, or barely, sometimes the canister is non-op, you need to wire the flapper open with zip ties
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)
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89er
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Re: Wiring query

Post by 89er »

letank wrote:
89er wrote:Diving into my wiring issues today. If this any of these look familiar to anyone I could sure use some help figuring them out.

Coming from firewall beneath vacuum reservoir - 3 wire cluster, zebra, green, blue
Image
The canister on the air filter housing that we can see on the pict, the one closest to the air filter can, needs to be connected to a vacuum source, otherwise the flapper called the kritter proof flapper will stay close and the engine will run poorly, or barely, sometimes the canister is non-op, you need to wire the flapper open with zip ties
Wow great to know

To clarify can you tell me which number is the one you're referring to vac for the kritter flap to open? Sounds like you're describing nip number 2. I found ahose with a screw in the end of it nearby, it runs down right below the vac reservoir. Perhaps that's the missing one?
Image
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan

letank
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Re: Wiring query

Post by letank »

number 2, has to go to manifold vacuum
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)
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tgreese
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Re: Wiring query

Post by tgreese »

2 & 3 are part of the TAC, described in the TSM. 1 is the vacuum reservoir.

The "kritter flap" may indeed keep animals out of the air cleaner, but that's not its intended purpose. It is connected to manifold vacuum and opens when the engine is running and closes when the engine is shut off. This keeps the fumes from the carburetor float bowl inside the air cleaner, forcing them to be recovered by the vapor control system rather than be vented to the air. It's a smog device.

Take the air cleaner off and look at it. Function of the two flaps should be clear from inspection.

Do you have the TSM for your year? If you don't have it, you should get it and read the section about the emissions devices. Way more information about your Jeep than we could ever cover here. Don't hunt and guess - read the manual.
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 Chryco Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green
Blockchain the vote.
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89er
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Re: Wiring query

Post by 89er »

tgreese wrote:2 & 3 are part of the TAC, described in the TSM. 1 is the vacuum reservoir.

The "kritter flap" may indeed keep animals out of the air cleaner, but that's not its intended purpose. It is connected to manifold vacuum and opens when the engine is running and closes when the engine is shut off. This keeps the fumes from the carburetor float bowl inside the air cleaner, forcing them to be recovered by the vapor control system rather than be vented to the air. It's a smog device.

Take the air cleaner off and look at it. Function of the two flaps should be clear from inspection.

Do you have the TSM for your year? If you don't have it, you should get it and read the section about the emissions devices. Way more information about your Jeep than we could ever cover here. Don't hunt and guess - read the manual.
I did get a hold of the FSM and found this handy diagram.

Image

I see the check valves for sale on teamgrandwagoneer but not the Reverse delay valves or a year-appropriate vacuum switch.

Does anyone know a good source to purchase the reverse delay valves or vacuum switch?

It also looks as if both of them connect up with the back side of the air cleaner housing, which I labeled number 1 on the picture.
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan

candymancan
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Re: Wiring query

Post by candymancan »

The picture with the red fat wire could be the power wire for the fog lights. It wires into a basic 30A relay and then from the relay to the fog lights.

Look for the relay and other wires along the fender wheel well engine bay side usually under all the junk for the cruise control and the washer bottles.

Bur i could be wrong there are a few big red wires there.. but i know the fog lights have one big fat red wire


The solenoids on the air hat require delay valve along with the vacuum lines.. If youre missing the coin shaped valves then you have more of a problem then just vacuum lines. Youre also missing the t line for the filter on the side of the air hat... Probly missing all the other delay valves... To be hinest as i ssid if you dont have emissions take the air hat off buy an open air filter one from autzone.. and be done with it. Your Jeep will run lile crap with the flapper closed


The blue wire by your blower motor mine has no blue wires around there.. so no idea what its for... follow it and see ? That big fat hose on the blower motor is disconnected as well plug it back in the hole on the firewall around.


Black wire under the Jeep in the back... never seen that before.. its probly just a frame to body ground someone added on.
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 219k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 430k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 155k
1976 Jeep J10.. 85k(repaired)
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89er
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Re: Wiring query

Post by 89er »

candymancan wrote:The picture with the red fat wire could be the power wire for the fog lights. It wires into a basic 30A relay and then from the relay to the fog lights.

Look for the relay and other wires along the fender wheel well engine bay side usually under all the junk for the cruise control and the washer bottles.

Bur i could be wrong there are a few big red wires there.. but i know the fog lights have one big fat red wire


The solenoids on the air hat require delay valve along with the vacuum lines.. If youre missing the coin shaped valves then you have more of a problem then just vacuum lines. Youre also missing the t line for the filter on the side of the air hat... Probly missing all the other delay valves... To be hinest as i ssid if you dont have emissions take the air hat off buy an open air filter one from autzone.. and be done with it. Your Jeep will run lile crap with the flapper closed


The blue wire by your blower motor mine has no blue wires around there.. so no idea what its for... follow it and see ? That big fat hose on the blower motor is disconnected as well plug it back in the hole on the firewall around.


Black wire under the Jeep in the back... never seen that before.. its probly just a frame to body ground someone added on.
Thank you. Thanks to the factory service electrical manual I found that the taped wire cluster were all the heater wires missing from the heater resistor.

The fat red wire ended up being Accessory Circuit Breaker Feed, no idea wtf that is or where it goes.

The black one on the back is just some ground, haven't traced it yet.

I do not have an emissions check being in rural texas and since Im missing so much of the emissions equipment I think I'll take your advice and just get an aftermarket open air filter. For now I have the flap opened with a coin slid into the lever underneath holding it open and a new air intake hose that runs up front.
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan

acct21
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Re: Wiring query

Post by acct21 »

location of that ground wire on the back driver side sure looks like it could be the gas tank sender ground.
1990 GW with HD towing package -- everything works! (today, anyway)

candymancan
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Re: Wiring query

Post by candymancan »

Ill take a pic of my firewall wires and note the big fat red wires.. mine has i tjink 2 of 3 of thrm and you should be able to trace yours based on my pics.. Since mine is a 90 it should be identical to yours.

My 90 had all the solenoids and valves for the stock airhat.. but i still removed that airhat.. I removed hakf of my vacuume lines.. and removed the air pump and long metal line going to the cat on the exhaust. My EGR is also not functioning when its plugged up to the vacuume lines it causes stalling.. So i just shoved screws in the lines.. screw the EGR..

I took some brass pipe plugs and used RTV to plug thrm in the exhaust manifold air tubes that the air pump pumps air into.

Jeep runs fine without all that crap and its much much much cleaner... Our engines put off such pitifull Hp having an open air filter vs the old air ram intake on the stock air hat isnt going to do jack shiat..

So yea a cleaner look and better performance of open air vs your blocked air hat is much simpler. Youll spend more time aggrivation and money finding those solenoids then just spending the 50$ to switch to the edlebrock air hat.

Make sure you get a air cleaner gasket autozone or advance should have it. Its like a felt gasket.
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 219k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 430k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 155k
1976 Jeep J10.. 85k(repaired)
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89er
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Re: Wiring query

Post by 89er »

With generous help from here and the Electric FSM I was able to figure out each of the original wiring questions I had, now the next set has presented themselves. (Passenger floorboard remains).

If there are any benevolent Jeep lords out there who find my case worthy of bestowing their knowledge on any of these mysteries I would greatly appreciate it.

1. (Appears to go to the instrument cluster and across the dash to passenger side)
Image

2. (3 wires runs from back passenger door to front passenger door, cut by PO on both ends)
Image

3. (no idea)
Image
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan
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tgreese
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Re: Wiring query

Post by tgreese »

I don't have time to look at the diagram now (I'm at work), but realize that not everything will be plugged in. The harnesses are built to work whether optional equipment is present or not. They did not make a separate harness design for every possible configuration.

Stuff that goes under the carpet could be seat belt alarm triggers, door ajar trigger, interior lights... somebody may know from memory. If not, the only way to sort it out is to trace back the wires and match with the wiring diagram. No one is more motivated to put the needed effort in this than you...
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 Chryco Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green
Blockchain the vote.

letank
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Re: Wiring query

Post by letank »

89er wrote:
3. (no idea)
Image
Because I pulled one a few months ago from an 86, but still a wild guess by the shape of the connector and the number of wires, looks like the AC wiring to the sensor on the driver's side AC conduit. There was change with the 86 year model because of the integrated climate control. Wire control might be different too.

If you are really keen on this rig, sometime buying the proper year manual is key. I have one for the 74, got a good deal on a 78 TSM that has a very good description to debug the gauges which is not on the 74 TSM. The generic like the Haynes is good because it has more of a beginner's view, it gives more details, better pictures, I have one of these too.

The TSM are a lot sharper for the electrical system.
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)

letank
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Re: Wiring query

Post by letank »

89er wrote:
1. (Appears to go to the instrument cluster and across the dash to passenger side)
Image
courtesy light?
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (229 Kmiles... the running test lab)
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89er
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Re: Wiring query

Post by 89er »

letank wrote:
Because I pulled one a few months ago from an 86, but still a wild guess by the shape of the connector and the number of wires, looks like the AC wiring to the sensor on the driver's side AC conduit. There was change with the 86 year model because of the integrated climate control. Wire control might be different too.

If you are really keen on this rig, sometime buying the proper year manual is key. I have one for the 74, got a good deal on a 78 TSM that has a very good description to debug the gauges which is not on the 74 TSM. The generic like the Haynes is good because it has more of a beginner's view, it gives more details, better pictures, I have one of these too.

The TSM are a lot sharper for the electrical system.
Thanks letank, that's just what I suspected. When I plugged that connector into the AC blower switch I immediately smelt burnt wiring smell and unplugged it. As I detailed in another threat ( http://www.fsjnetwork.com/forum/viewtop ... 10&t=15871 ) there was wire melt under the dash at some point so I'll need to iron all those out before trying it again.

The Jeep came with the Haynes manual but I really havent looked at it since and I purchased the 89 FSM and Electric manuals. I'm just too dumb and noob to utilize them properly. I can just about read the wiring diagrams with heavy use of the symbol legend but like you said there's little to no pics and no detail on connectors.
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan
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89er
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Re: Wiring query

Post by 89er »

Did some exploring on it and unbolted the bulkhead connector. Pretty nasty. Would like to clean it up and apply some modern dielectric grease. Anyone know a good method of cleaning the original grease off?

Image
'89 Grand Wagoneer Baltic-blue/Tan

candymancan
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Re: Wiring query

Post by candymancan »

Brake cleaner works wonders.. brake cleaner and a wire brush..

I had severely corroded plugs on the headlight and foglight plugs with 30 year old greese in them as well and good amount of brake clean and a metal brush got it looking brand new.

Maybe i should take my harness off and clean it up.. Are the bolts inside or outside to remove that from the firewall ?

Gatta tell you these burnt wires and actual melted grand wagoneers thst caught on fire in the salvage yards scare me... I have no melted wiring or burnt wiring in my dash yet... but it makes me wonder if itll happen to me... Thats why i got a fire extinguisher in my jeep.. I just dont trust it. Im considering installing quick disconnect fittings on the battery terminals as well.

The onky melted wire ive found on my Jeep was the foglight power wire.. Melted from the same cluster in your pic.. To the relay i mentioned under the washer bottles.. It was in the wrapped loom of wires too and melted about 4 wires.. When i cut it off the wire was about 70% exposed copper thats how bad it was melted.. I wish i knew how that started but judging by how horrible the relay looked and corroded the wiring to it looked i bet it was from that.. So i replaced the relay and wires

Outa the say 7 wagoneers ive found in salvage yards.. 3 were burned and you can tell the fires started in the center of the dash somewhere and these were all grand wagoneers 86+
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 219k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 430k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 155k
1976 Jeep J10.. 85k(repaired)
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