87 GW engine refresh

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rocklaurence
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby rocklaurence » Mon Mar 19, 2018 5:52 am

Sounds to me the Distributor is 180 out. Pull the Diz and rotate the rotor 180. Its easy to try and if it doesnt help-put it back.

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Mon Mar 19, 2018 8:18 am

rocklaurence wrote:Sounds to me the Distributor is 180 out. Pull the Diz and rotate the rotor 180. Its easy to try and if it doesnt help-put it back.
I did that... but when I put the timing cover back on I will be starting from scratch we will see what happens.... at this point I know I'm not doing something right just got to figure out what it is. I took a break from it yesterday or I was gonna light on fire and roast marshmallows and hot dogs... lol

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FSJ Guy
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby FSJ Guy » Mon Mar 19, 2018 12:46 pm

Ugh. OK.

So you're on the compression stroke. That's good.

LOL @ 7 ft wingspan! Impressive!

Keep us updated when you decide to tackle it again!
Ethan Brady

http://www.bigscaryjeep.com

Jeepless, but I still have a lots of old parts in my garage!

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Fri Mar 23, 2018 10:36 pm

Ok so I found problem number 1
Ignition control module.

Got it running and idling

Cylinder #6 dead at 75psi compression

Now I do live at 6000 feet or so all other cylinders are showing 105psi -110psi

Is this normal?

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

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tgreese
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby tgreese » Sat Mar 24, 2018 6:59 am

One bad cylinder is typically a burnt valve. A hole in the piston too, but you have too much compression for that, I'd think.

Add some oil to the cylinder and test again. Should have no effect if it's a valve problem. Compression will go up if it's leaking through the rings.
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Sat Mar 24, 2018 9:57 am

I just had these heads done. I wish I had an air compressor so I could do a leak down test. And the rings aren't seated yet

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

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ColoWagon
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby ColoWagon » Sat Mar 24, 2018 3:01 pm

Cheapthrills wrote:I just had these heads done. I wish I had an air compressor so I could do a leak down test. And the rings aren't seated yet

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)
I'm not far from you and can load my compressor and hook up for the spark plug. This weekend is shot but I believe I have availability next if it would help.
Give me a text. 303-728-4490
Brad

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- Brad

88 GW

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Sat Mar 24, 2018 10:02 pm

Well she's together and running... compression tests where flawed by me + my gauge is a quality gauge but is super old.

The main issue to start was bad ignition control module, and then a cracked spark plug.

So now to deal with it being guttles.... and get emissions stuff dealt with

I looked at tomsoljeep.com and it's the same thing on the emissions sticker (vague)

I was hoping to get lucky with the exhaust manifolds, they are both leaking due to broken bolts so...



87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

letank
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby letank » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:12 am

Cheapthrills wrote:
So now to deal with it being guttles.... and get emissions stuff dealt with

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)



Gutless, for high altitude, IIRC 16 degrees timing, I had a high altitude once and this is what was on the emission sticker... not too sure about Colorado emission rules.
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Sun Mar 25, 2018 8:39 am

letank wrote:
Cheapthrills wrote:
So now to deal with it being guttles.... and get emissions stuff dealt with

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)



Gutless, for high altitude, IIRC 16 degrees timing, I had a high altitude once and this is what was on the emission sticker... not too sure about Colorado emission rules.
My sticker says 19 but then it doesn't want to start so I set to 15. I'm pretty sure my 1406 needs rebuilt. She idles well but if you give it throttle driving down the road she suddenly start chuffing (falls on it's face), if you put it in neutral and give it 1/4-1/2 throttle It clears up in a few seconds.

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

letank
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby letank » Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:42 am

Cheapthrills wrote:My sticker says 19 but then it doesn't want to start so I set to 15. I'm pretty sure my 1406 needs rebuilt. She idles well but if you give it throttle driving down the road she suddenly start chuffing (falls on it's face), if you put it in neutral and give it 1/4-1/2 throttle It clears up in a few seconds.

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)


sounds like an enrichment circuit
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Sun Mar 25, 2018 10:32 am

letank wrote:
Cheapthrills wrote:My sticker says 19 but then it doesn't want to start so I set to 15. I'm pretty sure my 1406 needs rebuilt. She idles well but if you give it throttle driving down the road she suddenly start chuffing (falls on it's face), if you put it in neutral and give it 1/4-1/2 throttle It clears up in a few seconds.

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)


sounds like an enrichment circuit
Ok so this will make me sound like a f***tard, but what's that?

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

FSJ Guy
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby FSJ Guy » Sun Mar 25, 2018 12:16 pm

I think the person is talking about the power valve and possibly the accelerator pump.

The accelerator pump gives an extra shot of fuel when the throttle moves quickly.

The power valve gives extra fuel when the engine is under load. It measures load via vacuum. (or lack of vacuum, really.)
Ethan Brady

http://www.bigscaryjeep.com

Jeepless, but I still have a lots of old parts in my garage!

letank
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby letank » Sun Mar 25, 2018 3:04 pm

Cheapthrills wrote:
letank wrote:
Cheapthrills wrote:My sticker says 19 but then it doesn't want to start so I set to 15. I'm pretty sure my 1406 needs rebuilt. She idles well but if you give it throttle driving down the road she suddenly start chuffing (falls on it's face), if you put it in neutral and give it 1/4-1/2 throttle It clears up in a few seconds.

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)


sounds like an enrichment circuit
Ok so this will make me sound like a f***tard, but what's that?

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)


I would start with a baseline measurement of fuel pressure, if pressure is within specs, then carb work, with fuel float level, it if it dying and you need to put in neutral to clear the "trouble" it can be either too much fuel or not enough when accelerating.
Not familiar with 1406, but the owner's manual should be on edelbrock site

http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mis ... mit=search
Michel
74 wag (349 Kmiles... parked, next step is a rust free body)
85 Gwag (226 Kmiles... the running test lab)
See Engine bits and Fuel and brake lines, and Body work

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Sun Mar 25, 2018 5:46 pm

Rebuilt the 1406 and running much better.... needs fine tuning though... but I'm out of motivation at the moment.

Edit-Tried tuning it tonight and well it's got a rough idle, is this typical for an I'm guessing an rv cam? When I ordered from Napa the term RV was not used, I ordered a cam that was "A Step Up" and I can't find the cam card anywhere to tell you what it is.

When I rebuilt the 1406 I saw no major issues a novice could see. Both needle and seats where stamped the same and I followed instructions step by step. The floats had good movement and didn't seem to be sticking or show evidence of catching on the baffles. The rods looked ok no groovesall gaskets where replaced....

So anyways still making progress... and that's a good thing


87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

Cheapthrills
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Tue Mar 27, 2018 9:09 pm

I want to thank all that have provided tips and advice.

So I have a vacuum pressure tester that doubles as a fuel pressure tester.....
How do I use it to test fuel pressure?
It's an older unit with an unbarbed (5/16s ?) Connection

Thanks..



87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

FSJ Guy
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby FSJ Guy » Thu Mar 29, 2018 6:34 pm

Add it in into the fuel with a T fitting.

Unplug the line from the output of the fuel filter (that goes to the carb). Insert a T fitting and plug the old connections (to filter and from carb) to two of the connectors and the 3rd one goes to the pressure gauge.
Ethan Brady

http://www.bigscaryjeep.com

Jeepless, but I still have a lots of old parts in my garage!

Cheapthrills
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Location: Sedalia colorado

Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Sun Apr 08, 2018 10:11 pm

Figured out something went wrong during carb rebuild... engine is flooding... going to a aquire a new carb that is emissions legal.

Replaced exhaust manifold gaskets again with the ramflex gaskets, I love them.

Got the two broken bolts out of the heads while I was in there, and replaced my broken heater core box... put all new spark plugs in again .... she sounds good.

Just on hold for new carb now...

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)

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tgreese
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Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby tgreese » Mon Apr 09, 2018 9:27 am

Stuck float seems to be a common problem with the 21xx carbs. I suspect it's related to the way you have to bend the float tang to set the bowl level. If the tang is not perfectly square to the needle, it will hang.
Tim Reese
Maine beekeeper's truck: '77 J10 LWB, 258/T15/D20/3.54 bone stock, low options (delete radio), PS/PDB, hubcaps.
Browless and proud: '82 J20 360/T18/NP208/3.73, Destination A/Ts, 7600 GVWR
Copper Polly: '75 CJ-6, 304/T15, PS, BFG KM2s, soft top
GTI without the badges: '95 VW Golf Sport 2000cc 2D
Dual Everything: '15 FCA Jeep Cherokee KL Trailhawk, ECO Green

Cheapthrills
Posts: 605
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2016 7:09 am
Location: Sedalia colorado

Re: 87 GW engine refresh

Postby Cheapthrills » Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:14 am

Ordered edelbrock 1400 carb today should see it by tuesday

87 grand Wagoneer mostly stock
90 grand Wagoneer (stalled 5.3 project)


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