New install of A/C in 89 GW

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PaulD
Posts: 48
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:12 am
Location: Arkansas

New install of A/C in 89 GW

Post by PaulD »

When I bought my 89 GW, some PO had removed the compressor and brackets as well as the condenser coil. I am in the process of trying to get the A/C back running. Looking for any guidance you can provide concerning the following
> Hoses - all are still in place. No obvious damage. I plan to reuse them.
> Inside stuff - all in place. Vac system moves the doors as far as I an tell without opening the under dash unit up.
> Sanden compressor mounting bracket - missing from the rebuilt engine in my GW. Took me awhile to track down the right Sanden bracket but I now have one in hand along with the long bolts to attach it to the motor. Getting ready to install it and determine if it will interface correctly with the alternator
> alternator - Mine is new installed along with the rebuilt motor. However, it only had a single pulley. I now have a double pulley to install.
> Belts - will need new ones
> Compressor - Need to buy a new one - Sanden style but I have questions below
> Condenser coil - mine was missing but I now have a used on to install
> Dryer - Need to buy new one
> Refrigerant - undecided.
> Expansion valve - do not know if I really need one but will come with kit I expect to get
> Looking at ROCKAUTO for new parts. They offer kits with a compressor, dryer, expansion valve

Now for my questions before I spend money on new parts:
1) There were two models of Sanden compressors used in this time frame. The SD508 and the SD709. I understand that the SD709 was an improved model and replaced the SD508. ROCKAUTO offer both styles. Appears from pictures that the SD508 come with hose fitting for R12 and the SD709 has fittings for R134a. I am assuming my GW came from factory with hoses designed for the SD508. Can anyone confirm that?
2) Our GW came stock with R12 refrigerant but I had initially expected to use R134a in my new installation. Then I saw web info about using other refrigerants such as R290 (propane) and R152a (AirDuster). Apparently R290 works very well and is widely used in auto A/C, but I am leery of it. The R152a if cheap and readily available and is apparently very similar to R12 in performance. Although R134a is common today, it is in process of being phased out (to R1234yf) so that does not sound like a good long term solution to me. I do not plan to charge my system myself so I plan to discuss this with the garage I plan to use. He currently thinks I plan to go R134a. At this point, I am now leaning toward R152a because it is cheap and performs much better than R134a. Has anyone here actually used R152a and are happy or unhappy with it?
3) My condenser is used with an unknown history. I plan to try and blow it out and see if it has any debris from past compressor failure. If it looks clean, I plan to reuse it unless someone here offers a reason that is a bad idea.
4) Would like a good picture of how the alternator is mounted close to the Sanden A/C bracket. All I can find on web is picture using the York. I am not sure that I have all the right pieces to put the puzzle together.

candymancan
Posts: 3652
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:32 pm

Re: New install of A/C in 89 GW

Post by candymancan »

I've used the propane/butane cans before. Its called R12"a" they do that to trick people thinking its R12.. It sure did make my a/c ice cold.. however the butane/propane mixture can eat through Butyl rubber hoses which is what the original hoses are made of.. So when i learned this i let all the refrigerant out and put in r12 instead.

Also R134A is going to be discontinued or banned in new vehicles. I think 2017 is the year they mandated to stop using 134A i new vehicles and 2020 production will stop. It will still be sold and it wont "be mandated to stop making it.. at least for now) however prices are going to sky rocket.. In fact i suggest to anyone who has r134A vehicles to stock up on boxes of it. My 98 ZJ uses 134A and i need 1-2 cans a year not sure where my leak is. But its easier to just refill then spend all that money on fixing it. 134A was 60$ per 30lbs bottle last year. and Now its 120-140$ for a 30lbs bottle. The reason is because of the 134A ban, but a huge reason was because china was flooding the market with cheap 134A, and american companies like Dupont and so forth sued them and won so the USA now puts a huge tax on imports which caused prices to go way up so Dupont can goudge us to death again.

Right now 120-140$ isnt too bad, Walmart and Amazon has 134A for 12 cans $4.88 per can which is which is cheap. I plan to buy 24 cans here soon.

Anyway back on topic. R1234Yf doesnt cool as well as 134 or R12 or propane.. The reason they switched to 1234yf is because its an 11 or something compared to 1600 on the global warming index. R12 was banned because its a CFC and Chlorine was eating the Ozone layer. 134A has none of that and it doesnt affect the ozone, but it causes global warming "which is a gimmick if you ask me the earth is warming naturally but we wont get into that" Anyway the real reason 134A is being phazed out is because their patents are expiring lol so they came up with this new refrigerant lol..

Also 1234YF is EXPENSIVEEEEEE.. like 10x more then 134A

If you want to use the butane/propane mixture.. Get new hoses that arent Butyl. If you go r134A you need new hoses and a compressor for 134A. R12 uses different lubricating oils for the compressor. You can cause an explosion by using 134A in Mineral Oil vs PAG oil. And PAG oil can damage the old style compressors, and itll leak through the old hoses because 134A has smaller molecules and will leak through the old hoses. So you have three options.

1. Stick with your old hoses get a compressor that was used on the late model grand wagoneers as those were updated because the old ones were leak prone and use R12 which is about 25-35$ a can My 90 Has the updated one.

2. Get whole new 134A compressor, hoses and so forth and use R134A or propane/butane

3. Get the old compressor for R12 get new hoses though, and use the propane/butane.


If i had no A/C like you i would honestly get new hoses, a 134A compressor and new everything, and use 134A but stock up on it. Propane/butane though cools alot better thren 134A. the only issue ppl cry about is its obviously flammable.
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tgreese
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Re: New install of A/C in 89 GW

Post by tgreese »

Have you looked at or consulted the aftermarket AC companies? I kinda think I would stay away from RockAuto as a supplier of these parts. They are great for straight-forward parts purchases, but support is nonexistent if you have an issue, and since you will be piecing this together... if you run into trouble, you may be stuck with some expensive parts you don't need.

I suspect you'd be better off with a retrofit kit - or partial kit - from one of the aftermarket companies. Vintage Air is likely the best known, with other brands present on Summit and Jegs.

I have the opposite situation with my J-20 - all the under-hood stuff is still present, but the evaporator is hanging naked under the dash. Since I have a York compressor, I'd likely go with a complete kit and make it like a new and modern installation.
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Cassidy
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Re: New install of A/C in 89 GW

Post by Cassidy »

Swapped mine to 134a a few years ago no problems still blows ice cold.

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