rear Pinion seal replacement

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candymancan
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:15 pm

So a sleeve is what exactly ? some thin metal sleeve that goes in before the seal that the yoke slides inside ? I guess you need to torque the bolt to crush the sleeve until the pinion can be turned at a certain inch lbs ?

is that basically it ?


Ill use my 24 inch breaker bar to try to take the nut off first.. might as well try first i just dont wanna struggle on bolts anymore
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

rocklaurence
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby rocklaurence » Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:52 am

The Sleeve goes between the inner and outer bearing and collapses as you toque down the yoke, By pulling the two bearings closer together and deeper into their bearing races creates the pre-load. If you didnt have the sleeve or shimms, the preload on the bearings would be reach waay before the pinion nut would reach torque.

440sixpack
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby 440sixpack » Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:42 am

again, if you mark the nut and the shaft and return it to where it was none of this matters. if it worked before it will work again.

candymancan
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:11 pm

Ok thanks for help guys, just waiting on the parts and ill get too it when they get here.
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

candymancan
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Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:32 pm

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:47 pm

well im doing it now. I just used the impact to take thr nut off.. zipped right off. I had to use a pully puller to take the yoke off.. And a seal puller to yank the old seal out.

I had to take the cover off and drain it as it just kept dripping for an hour and i wanted a clean surface so the rtv i put around the outer edge of the seal sticks.

Is 85-140 standard oil ok for the diff ? i ca t seem to find 80-90 anywhere.. its all 70-140 sy thetic or with limited slip additive.. And while i have a limited slip i use Jeeps additive not premixed stuff.

85-140 is all i can find fir standard gear oil. plus i already got one bittle at home. Dont wanna spend more money if i dont have too.


Oh and the yoke has a groove in it where the seal sits... I hope that doesnt cause it to leak again.. Might need a new yoke not sure yet...
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

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Dr. Marneaus
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Location: Reno, NV

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby Dr. Marneaus » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:01 pm

I just stick a 2' long pipe wrench on the yoke, rotate it so its braced on the concrete, and then bust the nut loose with a breaker bar. Done and done.
Well it ain't just the smoke and the traffic jam that makes me the bitter fool I am But this four-wheel buggy is A-dollaring me to death.
For gas and oils and fluids and grease, And wires and tires and anti freeze....And them accessories, Well honey, that's something else.

candymancan
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Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:32 pm

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:02 pm

Well its all together now.. just took a 1 mile drive. No odd noises or anything... Uhg that was hard to torque to 210ft lbs on the ground with a long torque wrench getting in the way of the ground and frame couldnt jack the jeep up too high ir the tire would turn off the ground. but i got it.

Hopefully this fixed the leak.. The seal i got looked different then the old one.. but it seems to work
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

candymancan
Posts: 1621
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:32 pm

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Wed Apr 18, 2018 4:37 pm

well no leaks so far.. yay..

thanks for help guys.

Now lets see what else will start leaking lol
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

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Stuka
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby Stuka » Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:31 am

The rubber on the inner side of the seal should be fine with a small ring from the old seal. You also should not need any RTV. The outside is a press fit, the inside is rubber. Glad you got it done.

By chance where you able to turn the pinion by hand afterwards?
1981 J10 AMC 258 with HEI and Weber 32/36 DGEV Carb, T176, NP208, D44/M23 with 4.56 gears and Detroit Locker, 6" lift, 33x12.50 Cooper STT's, BJ's Offroad Rear Dozer Bumper.
2017 JKU Rubicon Stock, but not for long!
Pevious Jeeps: 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

candymancan
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Thu Apr 19, 2018 1:53 pm

Yea when i was jacking the Jeep up too high i could grab the wheel in the air and it was spinning by hand. I didnt check the yoke by hand but the wheel could be turned pretty easily. Sorry i didnt check that.. But it drives fine.

The seal i got was a spicer seal.. All metal cept the double rubber seal with grease in it. The original seal used rtv so thats why i used some where it presses in. Was a bitch to get in. Had to hammer it ina circle like 200 times.

Here it is all together

Image
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

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Stuka
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby Stuka » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:13 pm

Only reason I asked if you did it by hand is I have seen people get the pre-load too high, and it results in over heating the bearings. Nothing you would notice driving.

And yeah, the seal is a pain without the tool. Which is basically a puller with a piece of tubing that pushes the seal in.
1981 J10 AMC 258 with HEI and Weber 32/36 DGEV Carb, T176, NP208, D44/M23 with 4.56 gears and Detroit Locker, 6" lift, 33x12.50 Cooper STT's, BJ's Offroad Rear Dozer Bumper.
2017 JKU Rubicon Stock, but not for long!
Pevious Jeeps: 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

candymancan
Posts: 1621
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:32 pm

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:07 pm

Ill jack up the rear wheels tomorrow abd take the drive shaft off and see if i can turn the yoke with ease.


I did take off the like round washer that was sitting between the yoke and pinion bearing.. cleaned it up a bit it was grimey.. The bearings looked fine from what i could see of them anyway. and no up or down or side to side play.

I hear a wheel bearing like noise back there but its coming from the drivers side i suspect a bad wheel bearing or something. That side pops if i turn driving the jeep on a hill leaning to the right side and then go back to a flat surface.. If that makes sense

If the torque spec is 200-250 ft lbs and i did 210 how could i have made the preload too high ? But ill check it tomorrow.. I have an inch lbs torque wrench. what should i set it too to check ?
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

440sixpack
Posts: 279
Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2016 6:31 am

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby 440sixpack » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:22 pm

Again, if you mark the nut and shaft and return it to the same place none of this matters.

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Stuka
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby Stuka » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:24 pm

It all depends. The spec is 200-250 because every crush sleeve is a tiny bit different, and each bearing is slightly different, etc. Same goes for pre-load shim style. They are all a bit different.

For a NEW R&P, a D44 should have 14-19 in lbs. For used (which is basically what you are doing) it should be 6-9 inch lbs. BUT... It requires pulling the carrier, which I don't think you want to do.

For your case, the pinion should not feel loose, but it should rotate without much effort. Since you have the axle shafts in you will be spinning the tires, so obviously there will be some load. So, use your best judgment. If you want to pull the stuff and do it right, awesome. But I understand why you may not want to.
1981 J10 AMC 258 with HEI and Weber 32/36 DGEV Carb, T176, NP208, D44/M23 with 4.56 gears and Detroit Locker, 6" lift, 33x12.50 Cooper STT's, BJ's Offroad Rear Dozer Bumper.
2017 JKU Rubicon Stock, but not for long!
Pevious Jeeps: 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

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Stuka
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby Stuka » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:25 pm

440sixpack wrote:Again, if you mark the nut and shaft and return it to the same place none of this matters.


This only applies to a D44 that uses pre-load shims. This is NOT the case for crush sleeve versions. I can't recall if this is for his waggy or his ZJ.
1981 J10 AMC 258 with HEI and Weber 32/36 DGEV Carb, T176, NP208, D44/M23 with 4.56 gears and Detroit Locker, 6" lift, 33x12.50 Cooper STT's, BJ's Offroad Rear Dozer Bumper.
2017 JKU Rubicon Stock, but not for long!
Pevious Jeeps: 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

candymancan
Posts: 1621
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:32 pm

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:05 pm

Ill just use my best judgement.. tbh i dont even wanna jack the rear wheels up and take the drive shaft off again to grab the yoke and turn it lol but i guess it doesnt hurt to see. I can zip the tires off too to remove the weight and see how many inch lbs it takes to turn the yoke with my torque wrench. Would this be satisfactory ?


I think im fine though


This was on my wagoneer.
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k

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Stuka
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Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby Stuka » Thu Apr 19, 2018 11:26 pm

Try it with the t-case in neutral first. You can tell if it’s too tight just by rocking the pinion back and forth. I think you are most likely fine as well. Worn in gears and bearings are very forgiving. But never hurts to check.
1981 J10 AMC 258 with HEI and Weber 32/36 DGEV Carb, T176, NP208, D44/M23 with 4.56 gears and Detroit Locker, 6" lift, 33x12.50 Cooper STT's, BJ's Offroad Rear Dozer Bumper.
2017 JKU Rubicon Stock, but not for long!
Pevious Jeeps: 1975 Cherokee, 2008 JK, 2005 KJ, 1989 XJ

candymancan
Posts: 1621
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2016 11:32 pm

Re: rear Pinion seal replacement

Postby candymancan » Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:40 am

Oh yea i forgot i can put the tcase in neutral without needing to remove the drive shaft
2013 SS camaro, cammed, and modded too much to say 500 RWHP 30k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 5.9L Limited 191k
1998 Jeep Grand Cherokee 4.0 I6 laredo 256k
1990 Jeep Grand Wagoneer 126k


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